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Moderna CEO: 400% price hike on Covid vaccine “consistent with the value”

arstechnica.com

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Re: Moderna CEO: 400% price hike on Covid vaccine “consistent with the value”

#21

Post by nhchris »

Grim-444 wrote: post #7
nhchris wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oxford/AstraZeneca Covid vaccine research ‘was 97% publicly funded’ - https://www.theguardian.com/science/2021/apr/15/oxfordastraz... It would be nice to see a similar analysis for Moderna's vaccine, but of course the companies like to keep their cards close to their chest.

There's a difference between funding research and funding development and manufacturing. No company would develop and manufacture a drug if they wouldn't make profit of it, no matter how much related research was or wasn't done using public funding.

> There's a difference between funding research and funding development and manufacturing.

The 97% figure from the study is for research and development. As for manufacturing, they would recoup that from selling the vaccine at/slightly above manufacturing cost. As the article I linked states, they didn't like that deal.

And the next time they come out with some drug or vaccine, will we also just assume most of the funds were private, until proven otherwise? Why not assume the opposite, and let them prove they're not fleecing us? Are they so trustworthy and benevolent?

Re: Moderna CEO: 400% price hike on Covid vaccine “consistent with the value”

#22

Post by ljw1001 »

takahisah wrote: post #6
hestefisk wrote: post #2

This is why vaccine development and pharmaceuticals in general should be a public good, owned by the public sector, priced as a public good.

When was the last time USPS wowed you with their innovations and speed?

Yeah. Or Ma Bell

Re: Moderna CEO: 400% price hike on Covid vaccine “consistent with the value”

#23

Post by i67vw3 »

junofan wrote: post #20
RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #14

In terms of how much benefit a company provides, Moderna and Pfizer vaccines literally provided trillions of dollars of benefit as it saved a bunch of lives and enabled economies to restart. I want these types of companies to make obscene amounts of money. I want entrepreneurs and venture capitalists to fund these companies thinking they can make obscene amounts of money from them. I want bright young people to dream…

Don’t I pay for pandemic prevention with my taxes? Where’s that money going?

[flagged]

Re: Moderna CEO: 400% price hike on Covid vaccine “consistent with the value”

#24

Post by hairofadog »

takahisah wrote: post #6
hestefisk wrote: post #2

This is why vaccine development and pharmaceuticals in general should be a public good, owned by the public sector, priced as a public good.

When was the last time USPS wowed you with their innovations and speed?

Just today!

Re: Moderna CEO: 400% price hike on Covid vaccine “consistent with the value”

#26

Post by maxerickson »

just_steve_h wrote: post #8

Everyone acts like all these wonders arise from private innovation. They discount the decades of public investment that brought us to the point that a company could develop a specific mRNA vaccine. From the public roads and public education to the trillions spent over the past 50 years to bring computer and bio technologies to their current point, it’s public investment that makes it all possible. Our capitalist syst…

What value do you place on a delivered dose of vaccine?

Because the recipient profits the amount you get if you subtract the price of purchase and administration from that value.

So like say the value is $100. When the vaccine was $26, the recipient and government got about $74 of value for each shot delivered and Moderna got $26 minus the cost of developing and producing the vaccine. Who's getting most of the value there?

If you don't think the vaccine provides $100 of value, then the controversy here is that they've priced it outside of the range where it will do any good. Of course sensible parties like insurance companies know the value is much more than $100 and will pay for it.

Re: Moderna CEO: 400% price hike on Covid vaccine “consistent with the value”

#27

Post by klyrs »

75dvtwin wrote: post #18
hestefisk wrote: post #2

This is why vaccine development and pharmaceuticals in general should be a public good, owned by the public sector, priced as a public good.

Can we say the same thing about social media companies ? I would also suggest that 'owned by public sector' does not mean 'public good'. Even when a private corporation influenced/directed/controlled by federal authorities -- it is problematic. I do not know of a political system that can effectively check federal government so that it stays for public good. Money-sponsored or various threatened-by-force election mod…

> Can we say the same thing about social media companies?

Gotta be "good" to be a "public good."

Re: Moderna CEO: 400% price hike on Covid vaccine “consistent with the value”

#28

Post by amluto »

I guess pharmaceutical prices and “value” are inversely related to utility, then. At $26 per dose, two doses prevented well over 90% of Covid cases. At the new higher price, even the bivalent vaccine seems to prevent rather fewer cases [0].

Maybe Moderna can sell $1000 doses of saline solution!

[0] https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2022.12.17.22283625v... gives about 30% effectiveness for the bivalent vaccine (read it for what this means). https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/pdfs/mm7148e1-H.pdf gives IMO really quite embarrassingly poor results for vaccination of any sort.

edit: at least the relative vaccine effectiveness table towards the end of the MMWR report consists of entirely positive numbers.

Re: Moderna CEO: 400% price hike on Covid vaccine “consistent with the value”

#29

Post by petre »

Grim-444 wrote: post #7
nhchris wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oxford/AstraZeneca Covid vaccine research ‘was 97% publicly funded’ - https://www.theguardian.com/science/2021/apr/15/oxfordastraz... It would be nice to see a similar analysis for Moderna's vaccine, but of course the companies like to keep their cards close to their chest.

There's a difference between funding research and funding development and manufacturing. No company would develop and manufacture a drug if they wouldn't make profit of it, no matter how much related research was or wasn't done using public funding.

Then the company receiving public finds for R&D should grand licenses royality free for anyone in that country/union to manufacture the vaccine.

You're a Chinese company that wants to produce vaccines? Estabilsh a factory in the country of origin, obtain a license from the original manufacturer and start producing.

Re: Moderna CEO: 400% price hike on Covid vaccine “consistent with the value”

#30

Post by I_AM_A_SMURF »

arcanus wrote: post #3
hestefisk wrote: post #2

This is why vaccine development and pharmaceuticals in general should be a public good, owned by the public sector, priced as a public good.

This will greatly decrease R+D spending on disruptive new pharmaceutical drugs. The Covid vaccines were developed and deployed by private industry.

lol what? the Covid vaccines were funded by the US goverment (and others).
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