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‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

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Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#171

Post by pflanze »

Filligree wrote: post #59
SketchySeaBeast wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You really can't do worse than standing barefoot, soaking wet, on a stone floor, and grabbing a live fixture, can you? Would the wetness have actually helped? Why go through all that higher resistance human flesh when the current can go straight to ground via the electrolyte solution that's around you instead?

Only really the case if the available power is limited, so flowing around you means the voltage drops. Otherwise it'll just do both. That, and wet skin has (massively) lower resistance than dry skin. It's unlikely to work out for you. Skin is also hydrophobic. You're unlikely to have a complete circuit with no breaks on the outside of your body, unless you're currently standing in the shower.

I'd expect blood to conduct electricity much better than house hold water, due to higher salt content. Thus once the resistance of the skin has dropped because of the water on the skin, the path of least resistance should be through the inside of the body.

Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#172

Post by iso1631 »

Heat Stroke was something that really took me from my last hostile environment course. Sure bombs bangs and bullets are the things most think about in those types of hostile climbs, but I expect if I go to Ukraine for a few weeks I might have a bomb land on my head. The Matthew Power case it what really stuck with me.

He was a journalist who lived in New York, it was winter and well below freezing for weeks and he'd acclimatized, but he agreed to go for a walk with a friend in Uganda. So he flew there overnight, landed, went out drinking and catching up, then headed off on a walk along the Nile in 100F+ weather. They were fairly well prepared, had emergency satelite communication etc. First few days were fine, but then they headed off the road. Only a few miles, then over the course of an hour he went from needing a short break, to being delirious, struggled to drink, then finally passed out. The rescue helicopter they had the coverage for didn't get there in time - literally two hours from "can we pause a minute" to "he's dead".

Power was an experienced traveller, on a decent expedition, with good support. Not a flip-flop wearing tourist you find up half way up a mountain with no map and a twisted ankle. A walk for a few miles from a road in 30C sun is the kind of thing you may think will end up with some sunburn if you forget to wear a hat, not something that will kill a 39 year old before a helicopter can reach him.

Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#173

Post by TheCleric »

gernb wrote: post #167

I feel like the phrase "you only regret what you didn't do" is survivorship bias. I'm pretty confident the majority of the people that die in these situations were not happy to die.

Whoever says that must not have anxiety of any form. I regret things I've done that didn't even endanger anyone's life.

Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#174

Post by MrBuddyCasino »

jacquesm wrote: post #121
MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It really only goes that fast on even stretches, of which there are plenty in northern & east Germany, and you literally need minutes to get there - downhill you can go a bit faster, but that gets scary quick. As soon as there is even a slight incline it starts to slow down, thats true. And I'm talking about the LPG version with 90 PS! Thats why you want to floor it: "Und bist du nicht willig, so brauch ich Gewalt."

> Und bist du nicht willig, so brauch ich Gewalt. That had me laughing. Funny story: I once, long ago in the corridor stopped to help a bunch of people in a Trabant, the engine had seized and it really wasn't going to go anywhere so I offered to tow them behind my 230E, which could easily do that. They agreed happily and we hooked them up, and one of their party switched to my car to show me where to go (illegal to g…

Lovely story! I can see how 110 is scary in a Trabi, especially so considering the state the roads were in.

> there was also a strong camaraderie, 'us against the system'

I think this is what gets lost in prosperity, and what causes some of the current spiritual misery. You simply don't need other people anymore if you have enough money, which in turn destroys community. Maybe the land of plenty is a dystopia, and we're not meant to live like this for extended periods of time.

Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#175

Post by intrepidhero »

dsfyu404ed wrote: post #120
intrepidhero wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It only takes 80ma across your heart to stop it. Mains voltage, in both the US and the rest of the world, can easily develop that kind of current, especially if there is moisture involved. And yet plenty of folks have accidental contact without lasting effects. Electricity is fickle that way. The difference between, no problem and totally dead can be subtle, random and not obvious. It all depends on the path the curr…

>It only takes 80ma across your heart to stop it In a lab, sure. In reality you need a lot of amps going into the body to get enough amps across the heart to screw with it. Defibrillators wouldn't be chock full of capacitors if that wasn't the case. Constantly repeating these sorts of misleading DARE-esque talking points is why nobody takes what the safety preachers have to say seriously. People find out through life…

Defibrillators are full of capacitors to boost the voltage, not current. They also use carefully located electrodes, and come with a razor to remove body hair to create the ideal conditions to affect the heart because they need to work every time. That has nothing to do with whether residential power is dangerous or not.

I said mains voltage won't kill you every time but it definitely can. We wouldn't put it in residential settings if it was instant death. The problem is that the conditions that can lead to a deadly accident don't trigger any of our ape-brain fear response. Like any risk it should be approached with knowledge and care.

If you think any of the things you listed are fine and safe just because they don't result in "instant death" then I would say we have very different ideas about risk management.

I don't appreciate you calling me a liar for presenting facts and urging caution.

Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#176

Post by shagie »

antipotoad wrote: post #145
psychphysic wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What on Earth!? I just submitted Kyle Hills video on this early today to HN. What an eery coincidence. I hope it's not a bad omen that I keep coming across this topic today...

Seems about five others of us also linked his video in this thread :) Guess you’re experiencing the Baader-Meinhof effect, AKA the frequency illusion [1]. [1]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frequency_illusion

It is interesting that Practical Engineering is an often-cited channel on HN. Not surprising, but rather a good indication of its content, quality, and value.

Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#177

Post by MayeulC »

dsfyu404ed wrote: post #120
intrepidhero wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It only takes 80ma across your heart to stop it. Mains voltage, in both the US and the rest of the world, can easily develop that kind of current, especially if there is moisture involved. And yet plenty of folks have accidental contact without lasting effects. Electricity is fickle that way. The difference between, no problem and totally dead can be subtle, random and not obvious. It all depends on the path the curr…

>It only takes 80ma across your heart to stop it In a lab, sure. In reality you need a lot of amps going into the body to get enough amps across the heart to screw with it. Defibrillators wouldn't be chock full of capacitors if that wasn't the case. Constantly repeating these sorts of misleading DARE-esque talking points is why nobody takes what the safety preachers have to say seriously. People find out through life…

Hmm, I didn't experiment much with that, but most houses are wired with 30 mA differential circuit breakers. If there is a difference of more than 30 mA between phase and neutral, it means there is a leak to ground somewhere, so the breaker trips. Well below 80 mA (though not instantly).

If you're wet though, your impedance is lower, so a lot more current can flow through you. That makes it much more dangerous to touch electrical stuff. Same with being barefoot.

Our bodies also have capacitance (complex impedance), which makes us more sensitive to AC than DC.

What I don't get is why do we still use differential circuit breakers while connecting neutral with ground instead of monitoring line impedance a thousand times a second. You'd trip the circuit breaker when connecting (including touching) neutral or phase to ground, without endangering the user (currently we only detect a user touching phase via the current flowing through them).

Have the circuit self-test multiple times a second, and use 10kV (like livestock fences) with very low capacity to measure impedance: give a serious jolt to the person touching a wire, with no danger.

Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#178

Post by cassepipe »

phillc73 wrote: post #111
emtel wrote: post #48

One time, I was driving at night in the Sierra after a storm - roads were covered in snow. It's a drive I've made close to 100 times without incident. Going around a bend, I saw a car in the ditch on the outside of the curve. I stopped the car, put on the hazards, and went to see if there was anyone in the car. As I was about to cross the highway a car come sliding around the bend more or less sideways. I stopped and…

Last Saturday afternoon I was driving home in heavy fog. Suddenly coming towards me was a BMW SUV at least 75% in my lane. I managed to brake heavily and drift towards the outside verge. We didn’t hit. It’s about the closest I’ve come to a head on collision. With my whole family in the car, there was utter silence for the next several minutes. Pretty sure I nearly died three days ago.

In case you had hit, a deadly accident would be more likely because of the SUV's weigh. A 4000 pounds vehicle contains has twice the energy of a 2000 pounds vehicle at the same speed. Just another example of inequality in face of death between rich and poor.

Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#179

Post by antipotoad »

phillc73 wrote: post #151
antipotoad wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From one survivor of a near-certain-death scenario to another: glad that you’re still here with us to tell your story. No two experiences are alike, but don’t be surprised if it takes you a long while to process what happened. Good that you’re able to talk about it here; if you can, I encourage you to talk to your family about it, even if only to let them know you acknowledge it happened. (Then again, feel free to ig…

Comment appreciated. My wife, in the front seat next to me, and I were certainly in shock. We pulled over and had a 15 minutes rest while the adrenaline wore off. We breathed deeply and talked about what had just happened. I used to commute in London for many years on a motorcyle and also raced them for a few years. I've had my share of near misses and ended up in hospital once. That was all somehow different - it wa…

Glad to be of even the smallest help. I think you have the right head on for dealing with this. Just keep open the door to communication with all the others, especially since the shock will fade differently for each of you.

All I can say is that it took me a long time to regain the appetite for calculated risk. My companion in the scenario seemingly shrugged it right off, but only through keeping talking did I know otherwise.

Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#180

Post by anthomtb »

scanny wrote: post #22
AYBABTME wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I almost drowned on a beach without surveillance, jumping into the surf waist high, for fun, until suddenly the receding water pulled me just a few meters further away and now I couldn't touch the floor anymore, and was slowly being pulled further and further away from the beach. My girlfriend of the time was on the beach far enough away that she couldn't hear or grasp that I was struggling. By luck and after perhaps…

Sounds like you encountered a "rip" [0]; usually letting it take you out and then swimming after the current eases is the safest thing to do. At school (Oceania) we get taught this as part of water safety, but I suppose it would be a foreign concept to many people, particularly those not living near the coast. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rip_current

Can confirm. My childhood in Colorado taught me nothing of rip currents. A few weeks on the east coast of Australia was quite the eye-opener.
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