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Microsoft will have to buy OpenAI in 2023

thoughtfulbits.me

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Re: Microsoft will have to buy OpenAI in 2023

#31

The underlying assumption here is that Sam would be willing to sell OpenAI. I don't think that's the case. There's no amount of money that Microsoft could throw at Sam to convince him to sell. Not only is he already wealthy, but he's also a true believer in AI. And unlike Snapchat, it's going to be very hard for incumbents to clone.

> There's no amount of money that Microsoft could throw at Sam to convince him to sell.

Every experience I ever had of people who achieve power and success tells me that you are wrong. His own wealth is irrelevant. His beliefs are also not relevant. It is very likely he will want to "take the next step". He can always use that next shit ton of money to invest in the next big thing in AI.

Re: Microsoft will have to buy OpenAI in 2023

#32
post #14

I think OpenAI made two strategic blunders: 1. Publishing the Dall-E papers and pre-trained CLIP weights. This inspired Stable Diffusion/MidJourney, reducing the amount of time OpenAI had for their Dall-E service to get established by maybe a year. During that time, they could've gained long-term customers, generated some revenue, and established partnerships with Adobe and other graphics software makers. Now they're…

Hard disagree, I think 2 is actually a genius move after major fail with dall-e 2 pricing model. In general, they are probably looking for stable diffusion like adoption curve, but unless they have an offering people can use for free that is flexible enough (giving users just a prompt box is not flexible enough), someone else is going to eat their lunch on LLM's too, when you won't need colab to run them.

I don't understand: many more people would use it for free in Bing/Word/Cortana than on a website that nobody used previously.

Re: Microsoft will have to buy OpenAI in 2023

#33
post #29
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe OpenAI is for profit since 2019 now. See https://techcrunch.com/2019/03/11/openai-shifts-from-nonprof...

ok, so? The mentioned things are strategic blunders if their goal is to maximise profit (maybe). If they have some other goal, they might not be blunders. In fact they might be on track with what they want to achieve. The legal form of the corporate structure is not the deciding factor here. What are their goals is.

They are acting as if they want to be acquired. Publishing results and making a splash with your technology is a good way to get acquired.

Re: Microsoft will have to buy OpenAI in 2023

#34

>AI similarly has powerful network effects. OpenAI's current business model is genius. By allowing free usage of chatGPT, they are getting millions of "free" employees, all actively and eagerly providing more data and more training to the system. I never buy this. This story is repeated so often in so many places. You hear it about Tesla all the time "Their dataset is so big because they have all those cars out there…

I doubt the data OpenAI receives from the usage of ChatGPT is even remotely close to the amount of data Google or Facebook handles that could be used to build a better language model.

They have advantage over other AI startups, but I don't think they have much of an advantage over companies like Google and Facebook which both have massive amounts of data, money, and computing power. Which at the current state is the three most important things needed to build models that can operate at internet scale.

OpenAI can never run ChatGPT at the scale needed for massive usage. They would drown in debt. Hence why ChatGPT is extremely slow, often crashes, and is protected by a rate limiter.

Re: Microsoft will have to buy OpenAI in 2023

#37

Hand wave all you like. If Microsoft is putting money into a 3rd party company for their AI (and, they are. right now ) …that is fundamentally not sustainable as the “total value” of the relationship increases. Either a) Microsoft will in-house their own version and drop openAI, or b) they’ll buy them. Any other conclusion that anyone draws about Microsoft’s commercial relationships is delusional. The only point in c…

OpenAI is already very dependent on Microsoft for access to data. And MS is one of their major investors. So there's no pressure on either party to act in a hurry.

A reason for MS to buy OpenAI would presumably be to deny access to third parties to the AI and make it some kind of exclusive MS only feature. The problem with that is of course that all the research has been published already and outside researchers and developers are already replicating their results. That cat is already out of the bag. E.g. Google has some AI models that it has chosen not to release yet that are similar to GPT. Also, companies like this are heavily dependent on their people and they tend to start jumping ship in case of an acquihire where they receive a lot of equity. So, there's a question of what it is they would be buying.

What's more likely, is that OpenAI will power a long tail of smaller AI companies and create a lot of value that way, while the bigger companies will use their data leverage, and access to vast amounts of infrastructure to use the same algorithms to produce better AI models.

MS and OpenAI are of course collaborating pretty deeply with OpenAI already. They are using Azure and have access to a lot of MS controlled training data. Historically, AI algorithms have been public research with the understanding that they are relatively low value without a lot of infrastructure and training data. The likes of wikipedia only get you so far. So, OpenAI is basically that plus MS provided infrastructure and data. You can machine learn all you want on your laptop but you won't get anywhere until you put a few billion on the table for access to infrastructure and data. MS has done that through OpenAI.

I imagine, MS has some pretty favorable licensing agreement with them as well in exchange. That kind of symbiotic relation ship is mutually beneficial. And with OpenAI set to generate some serious revenue in the next years, it's a pretty good investment too.

MS might be better off buying some of the more successful openai using startups in this space and then integrating their features rather than building those features in house. After they acquire those smaller startups at a relatively low price, they can level them up with better data and access to infrastructure. Leave the experimenting and risk taking to the startups. MS has had a relatively successful acquisition strategy in recent years with some real value added to their products via acquisitions.

It's a very different strategy than what Google is doing. Google is being secretive and probably not that effective in terms of generating revenue from what they have done so far (regardless of how good that is). Making search slightly better isn't going to move the needle for them. Google translate is no longer best in class. There are some gimmicky features on docs and gmail but it's not quite at the same level as OpenAI. Typical Google: lots of R&D but very little to show for their money so far.

I think I like the MS strategy better. There's a learning curve with this kind of stuff and doing it in the open speeds that up massively. Shorter feedback loops, more rapid iteration, etc. Google could do the same of course but so far they are choosing to do everything on their own. They are a bit like MS used to be. I don't think that's a good strategy.

Re: Microsoft will have to buy OpenAI in 2023

#38

>AI similarly has powerful network effects. OpenAI's current business model is genius. By allowing free usage of chatGPT, they are getting millions of "free" employees, all actively and eagerly providing more data and more training to the system. I never buy this. This story is repeated so often in so many places. You hear it about Tesla all the time "Their dataset is so big because they have all those cars out there…

I doubt the data OpenAI receives from the usage of ChatGPT is even remotely close to the amount of data Google or Facebook handles that could be used to build a better language model. They have advantage over other AI startups, but I don't think they have much of an advantage over companies like Google and Facebook which both have massive amounts of data, money, and computing power. Which at the current state is the…

Agreed. Google processes about 8.5 billion search queries daily. Conversational voice assistants process about 120 million queries daily.

Re: Microsoft will have to buy OpenAI in 2023

#39
post #14

I think OpenAI made two strategic blunders: 1. Publishing the Dall-E papers and pre-trained CLIP weights. This inspired Stable Diffusion/MidJourney, reducing the amount of time OpenAI had for their Dall-E service to get established by maybe a year. During that time, they could've gained long-term customers, generated some revenue, and established partnerships with Adobe and other graphics software makers. Now they're…

I hope your ideas are never implemented and I'd rather that these ideas burn in hell.

OpenAI is already a misnomer, don't make them comically evil.

AI needs more democratization ala huggingface. Not more """""Open"""""AI

Re: Microsoft will have to buy OpenAI in 2023

#40

>AI similarly has powerful network effects. OpenAI's current business model is genius. By allowing free usage of chatGPT, they are getting millions of "free" employees, all actively and eagerly providing more data and more training to the system. I never buy this. This story is repeated so often in so many places. You hear it about Tesla all the time "Their dataset is so big because they have all those cars out there…

This is an old narrative focused on the foibles of supervised learning. The data acquired by chatGPT and Tesla is extremely valuable even while unlabeled. It can be used for pretraining, both self and unsupervised. I guarantee you that having larger and more diverse datasets for pretraining provides a lot of advantages.
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