Study finds that buttons in cars are safer and quicker to use than touchscreens • Hacker News Board

Re: Study finds that buttons in cars are safer and quicker to use than touchscreens

#121

Post by phpisthebest » Sat, Jan 07, 2023, 3:59 PM UTC

happymellon wrote: post #106

phpisthebest wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>I would love to see some EU legislation Why does the EU believe every facet of life needs to be ordered and control by government regulation, is there any area of life at all in the EU that should be free from government interference? That is an honest question because every time anything comes up the first response from citizens of the EU is to declare government should be the right and proper resolution to the pr…

Because leaving it "to the market" is always a race to the bottom, and there ends up being no choice on voting with your wallet.

You do know that Touch Screen got included in Cars due to government regulations right? The government mandated Backup Camera's and once you had to put in a screen to serve as display for the backup camera then it only makes since to use that screen for more and more things

This is yet another unintended consequence of government regulations, where by now people want to use government regulation to "fix" the problems the regulation caused in the first place, which will cause even more problems as regulation always does

>>"to the market" is always a race to the bottom

Absolutely false, the market more than anything in human society has driven more wealth, and higher standards of living. If it incredibly ignorant to say the market is a "race the to bottom" backed by ZERO data or facts

Re: Study finds that buttons in cars are safer and quicker to use than touchscreens

#122

Post by epolanski » Sat, Jan 07, 2023, 3:59 PM UTC

To add on that: digital tech in cars is god awful and ages very poorly.

Entering some top end cars like the newest S class and even more the electric counterparts seems like entering a night club filled with tablets[1]

https://www.carbibles.com/uploads/2021/04/15/laser.jpg?auto=...

Re: Study finds that buttons in cars are safer and quicker to use than touchscreens

#123

Post by cs702 » Sat, Jan 07, 2023, 3:59 PM UTC

acdha wrote: post #43

cs702 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you, say, check tire pressure? Setup a new garage-door opener? View your calendar for today? Do you have physical buttons for those things? A car that does everything (or "almost anything") via physical buttons would be insanely hard to use . It would look like, and be about as easy to use as, a jet cockpit. The best approach is clearly not all-physical-buttons, nor all-touchscreen-buttons, nor all-voice-comma…

Those are not things you need to do while driving. There’s no reason why, say, garage door pairing can’t use a button like my 2006 Subaru does for the one time most people will do it in the life of the vehicle. Checking a calendar is distracted driving and should be illegal.

> Checking a calendar is distracted driving and should be illegal.

Tesla vehicles, as well as iOS and Android car UIs, have functionality for navigating to the next appointment in your calendar, if the appointment has a physical address. For a lot of folks, e.g., salespeople and service crews, this is a godsend.

Re: Study finds that buttons in cars are safer and quicker to use than touchscreens

#124

Post by cycrutchfield » Sat, Jan 07, 2023, 3:59 PM UTC

acdha wrote: post #64

cycrutchfield wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for this. There is a very vocal minority on HN that cries bloody murder about touchscreens in cars. Anything that argues against the hivemind is often downvoted and dismissed without much thought or self-reflection.

It’s interesting that you say that because the people arguing against touchscreens are writing long thoughtful comments aligned with decades of human factors research, quite notably contrasting with proponents.

Which thoughtful comments? “Well duh”? Are there any comments looking critically at the original study or are they all just using the headline to confirm their biases?

Re: Study finds that buttons in cars are safer and quicker to use than touchscreens

#125

Post by randerson » Sat, Jan 07, 2023, 4:00 PM UTC

mojuba wrote: post #26

So the last bastion is the steering wheel it seems. Will it be replaced with a pair of arrow buttons on the screen? /s

There are already manufacturers, including luxury German ones, using capacitive touchscreen-like buttons on steering wheels. Ugh.

Re: Study finds that buttons in cars are safer and quicker to use than touchscreens

#126

Post by mindslight » Sat, Jan 07, 2023, 4:00 PM UTC

ht85 wrote: post #79

ajross wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the proper control to use for interacting with a navigation aid in the UK? Or are you saying that UK law forbids in-car maps? These arguments always end up in this kind of hyper-specific realm where they seem to apply only to Tesla's particular design choices. But, in car maps are everywhere now (and, yes, Tesla's implementation is by far the best), and the natural way you use them is with touch. They absolute…

> What's the proper control to use for interacting with a navigation 1. Voice control 2. Pull over

Back in the day I did a long cross country trip with a Garmin 60CSx hiking GPS, held in my right hand, which I was also shifting with. I didn't use it for turn by turn navigation (not a fan, especially for road trips), but rather a detailed map with a live "you are here" indicator. To look at it, I held the unit halfway up and glanced down when I could naturally spare the attention. For input, I pushed the buttons without looking, since I could predict the unit's states (push button X to zoom out, push button Y 3 times to get from map screen to statistics screen, etc). It even had text input, in the form you'd probably grimace at (alphabetically-ordered grid of letters, move using arrow buttons, select using enter button), which I believe I did while driving with no problem (it took quite a while to enter anything, of course). Due to the predictable input states and physical buttons that I never had to consciously locate (same position in my hand), it never felt like it affected my OODA loop or otherwise stole my attention.

Re: Study finds that buttons in cars are safer and quicker to use than touchscreens

#127

Post by rafale » Sat, Jan 07, 2023, 4:00 PM UTC

happymellon wrote: post #106

phpisthebest wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>I would love to see some EU legislation Why does the EU believe every facet of life needs to be ordered and control by government regulation, is there any area of life at all in the EU that should be free from government interference? That is an honest question because every time anything comes up the first response from citizens of the EU is to declare government should be the right and proper resolution to the pr…

Because leaving it "to the market" is always a race to the bottom, and there ends up being no choice on voting with your wallet.

Like the iPhone for example? Or maybe the Porsche 911 GT3 RS? Markets have a lot of segments. Government should regulate the minimum absolute necessity. Like seatbelts... who were ironically a market invention/idea first.

Re: Study finds that buttons in cars are safer and quicker to use than touchscreens

#128

Post by epolanski » Sat, Jan 07, 2023, 4:01 PM UTC

phpisthebest wrote: post #104

PreInternet01 wrote: post #17

I would love to see some EU legislation about car dashboards. As an occasional driver of many different brands and types of vehicles, I continue to be amazed at the usability crimes being committed in the name of 'looking cool' (stated reason) as well as 'cost savings' (most likely the real reason). Any function that needs to be invoked or setting that needs to be changed by a reasonable person while driving should h…

>>I would love to see some EU legislation Why does the EU believe every facet of life needs to be ordered and control by government regulation, is there any area of life at all in the EU that should be free from government interference? That is an honest question because every time anything comes up the first response from citizens of the EU is to declare government should be the right and proper resolution to the pr…

They should in this case, this involves road and public safety.

Re: Study finds that buttons in cars are safer and quicker to use than touchscreens

#129

Post by phpisthebest » Sat, Jan 07, 2023, 4:01 PM UTC

messe wrote: post #120

phpisthebest wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>I would love to see some EU legislation Why does the EU believe every facet of life needs to be ordered and control by government regulation, is there any area of life at all in the EU that should be free from government interference? That is an honest question because every time anything comes up the first response from citizens of the EU is to declare government should be the right and proper resolution to the pr…

Generally, it only tends to come up in any area where the market seems to be failing consumers. This is interpreted as an externality that the market doesn't account for (in this case consumer safety, in the case of USB-C charging e-waste), which regulations are then introduced to correct for.

>>in this case consumer safety

Ironic since safety laws is what put the screens in the cars in the first place, the regulation requiring backup camera's which required large screen to show the picture.

>>in the case of USB-C charging e-waste

lol, yea that is not the reason for USB-C regulation, nor was that needed at all, and that will handicap either the EU or global innovation. What ever comes next to replace USB-C either now will never be made and will be stuck (I hope not, because USB-C is terrible) or the EU will be left behind has the rest of the world moves on to the better thing

Re: Study finds that buttons in cars are safer and quicker to use than touchscreens

#130

Post by mccorrinall » Sat, Jan 07, 2023, 4:02 PM UTC

ht85 wrote: post #79

ajross wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the proper control to use for interacting with a navigation aid in the UK? Or are you saying that UK law forbids in-car maps? These arguments always end up in this kind of hyper-specific realm where they seem to apply only to Tesla's particular design choices. But, in car maps are everywhere now (and, yes, Tesla's implementation is by far the best), and the natural way you use them is with touch. They absolute…

> What's the proper control to use for interacting with a navigation 1. Voice control 2. Pull over

My Audi has a knob which I can rotate in order to navigate through the menus without taking my eyes off the street. It also has a touch screen, but I only use it when standing still.