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Less gym time, same results: Why ‘lowering’ weights is all you need to do

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Re: Less gym time, same results: Why ‘lowering’ weights is all you need to do

#171

Post by j33zusjuice »

ehnto wrote: post #113
MichaelDickens wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Eventually you will get to a point on that exercise where your concentric pull can put up vastly more weight than you can safely lower to the ground in a slow manner. I'm not particularly qualified to speak on this, but this does not match my experience. I can deadlift 455 lb with great difficulty, but I can lower 455 lb to the ground fairly easily. And I don't see any physiological reason why this would be true—if…

Gravity acts over time, if you are slowly lowering it you could be expriencing the same force practically as on the way up. The reason you don't do it for powerlifting is because you're more likely to injure yourself after a max effort lift (like a one rep max lift in competition). Since you exerted maximally on the way up and may struggle controlling it on the way down it while exhausted. All the other compound lift…

It great advice for exactly the reason you stated. And in gyms that disallow dropping, you give minimal effort on the way down, just enough to not get kicked out.

If you’re hellbent on doing long eccentrics on your low back, do it on back extensions with light weights. I used to do them. I always regretted it the next day.

Re: Less gym time, same results: Why ‘lowering’ weights is all you need to do

#172

Post by sawmurai »

robomartin wrote: post #34

Yeah, well. Here's a concept: Every single researcher who wants to conduct these kinds of experiments needs to, as a prerequisite, read Starting Strength [0] and then go to a certified gym for a year or more before even remotely being able to say anything useful about the subject. Yes, sure, Starting Strength isn't perfect. I am not presenting it as the sum of all knowledge and the one-and-only true anything. However…

Yeah, the day you start your linear progression with Starting Strength is the day you stop subscribing to fitness social media and just get strong :) I fondly remember the times

Re: Less gym time, same results: Why ‘lowering’ weights is all you need to do

#173

Post by claytongulick »

naet wrote: post #58
mrob wrote: post #15

I used eccentric muscle contractions to gain enough strength to do pull-ups when I was too weak to do even one. I stood on a chair to get into the top position, then lowered myself as slowly as I could. The exercise was effective, and after a few weeks I could do full pull-ups without the chair.

Doing "negative" pullups also helped me build up from zero to a max of about ten regular pullups in one set. Unfortunately I took a long break from strength training and can now barely do 1-2. Was just thinking of going back to negatives to start rebuilding my strength.

There was a recent study somewhere that talked about how they'd cracked the code on muscle memory.

We've known for a long time that it's way easier to regain muscle than it is to develop it in the first place.

Turns out the reason is pretty simple, muscle cells are similar to fat cells - meaning that they never go away. They just activate as needed.

So it takes enormous effort to develop muscle cells, but one you have them, getting the size and strength back after taking a break is way easier.

Re: Less gym time, same results: Why ‘lowering’ weights is all you need to do

#174

Post by claytongulick »

wnolens wrote: post #76
nordsieck wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I am trying to build upper body strength and pull-ups kill me IMO, the best thing is if you have access to an assisted pull up machine or lat pull down. Bands can work alright (and they're cheap!), but assisted pull ups and/or lat pull down allow you finely tune your progressive overload. The general problem with bands (and spring type resistance in general) is that the non-linear resistance makes it more difficult…

I'd have to disagree. To me a negative is worth more than an assisted rep because you get to practice the real range of motion and activate all muscles (incl. stabilizers). Assisted forms ultimately "assist" you at some fixed point which alters the path you would take if hanging, often removing your core entirely. Also, I'd take the non-linear resistance of bands over the absence of core activation from a pull-up mac…

I'm a big calisthenics nerd, and I agree with this.

For reference, I'm a rounding error away from 50 and I still do advanced bar work - muscle ups, archer pullups, pull overs, etc...

I think it's important to always work with your bodyweight.

80% of strength is neuronal coordination, you'll get strong with the way you train.

Use your bodyweight in closed kinetic chain [1] exercises and avoid the machines unless you're injured or have a specific reason.

There are progressions for every level.

I recommend "Be your own gym" and "Overcoming Gravity" for great references on bodyweight training.

(Also: don't do muscle ups. The only people who like that are sports medicine docs.)

[1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closed_kinetic_chain_exercis....

Re: Less gym time, same results: Why ‘lowering’ weights is all you need to do

#175

Post by j33zusjuice »

cameronh90 wrote: post #136

Has anyone else had a complete lack of success with any kind of weight lifting? I find that whenever I try to lift, it starts well, but after a few weeks, the amount I can lift over time begins to decrease and I start getting pain in my tendons. I've tried low reps low weight, high reps low weight, 1 day a week 3 days a week, etc. had my form checked by a personal trainer and there doesn't seem to be any obvious reas…

That is not normal. You should see a doctor.

I’m assuming you started with very low weight and slowly increased over a period of 4-8 weeks. It wouldn’t be too surprising if your joints hurt in non-debilitating way for the first few weeks you started working out, but it should subside fairly quickly between workouts.

If you can’t or won’t go to a doctor for some reason, and you want to try weight lifting again, you could look into joint supplements like glucosamine and chondroitin (https://bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/dietary-supplement...), and maybe look non-pharmaceutical anti-inflammatories (turmeric, etc.). It might be worth looking into these things if your joints can’t handle stress even if you don’t want to lift.

Of course, this is non-medical write. I think this is a good idea, but I don’t know if these supplements are contraindicated for you somehow.

Re: Less gym time, same results: Why ‘lowering’ weights is all you need to do

#176

Post by j33zusjuice »

faithcsc wrote: post #158
cameronh90 wrote: post #136

Has anyone else had a complete lack of success with any kind of weight lifting? I find that whenever I try to lift, it starts well, but after a few weeks, the amount I can lift over time begins to decrease and I start getting pain in my tendons. I've tried low reps low weight, high reps low weight, 1 day a week 3 days a week, etc. had my form checked by a personal trainer and there doesn't seem to be any obvious reas…

I had the exact same experience and have recently given up. Tried to lift less, eat better, etc. No matter what, I would randomly get really exhausted for 3-4 days. It just wasn't sustainable. My new years resolution is to quit lifting and find any exercise routine that's sustainable and doesn't drain my energy.

Have you seen a doctor? Because your body should not respond so negatively.

It may also be worth exploring joint health supplements. https://bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/dietary-supplement...

I can’t imagine whatever you two have going on is indicative of good joint health, so supplementing some support may be a good idea for you even if you stick to your resolution. Of course, I think this is good advice, but I don’t know if these supplements are contraindicated for you somehow, so you should see a doctor either way, imo.

Re: Less gym time, same results: Why ‘lowering’ weights is all you need to do

#177

Post by lta »

j33zusjuice wrote: post #168
MichaelDickens wrote: post #93

As is often the case with these sorts of studies, I'd be wary of over-extrapolating. The study specifically looked at the dumbbell curl only among untrained individuals. If you did a similar study on trained individuals, or on a compound movement like a squat or a bench press, I'd expect to see different results. (In fact, it's effectively impossible to only perform the eccentric portion of a squat or a bench press u…

> (In fact, it's effectively impossible to only perform the eccentric portion of a squat or a bench press unless you're only doing a single rep.) That’s true for all movements, unless someone is resetting it for you. If you don’t move the weight to the top, you can’t lower it again.

I guess for many movements, it's possible to switch to a one-sided equivalent and use the other hand for an easier reset. Barbell press -> dumbbell press

Re: Less gym time, same results: Why ‘lowering’ weights is all you need to do

#178

Post by daniel-cussen »

temprose wrote: post #73
stavros wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The best thing I did for my pullups was lose weight. It's amazing what a difference losing 20 lbs will do for your ability to do pullups.

For me it's the reverse, I gained weight and noticed how much harder it is. Used to be able to do like 5-6 unassisted pullups and now that I've been bulking and gained like 20 lbs, it's a bit harder. Too be honest, most of my weight gain is probably creatine lol.

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