I was on BloombergTV talking SOPA today - how'd I do? • Hacker News Board

Re: I was on BloombergTV talking SOPA today - how'd I do?

#131

Post by zachrose » Thu, Jan 05, 2012, 8:23 AM UTC

DevX101 wrote: post #37

edw519 wrote: post #19

Alexis, you did great. Cool, calm, collected, and sharp. You did a great job advocating what most of us here understand and champion. But here is the problem I see with this whole SOPA debate... I didn't see anything that would help my Uncle Art understand what this is all about in his language and why he should care. This is what he sees: - There is a bill in congress. - It's to stop people from stealing other peopl…

Despite my differences with much of the Republican party platform, one thing that they are damn good at and I respect them for is an ability to communicate with their target base. Where's there's a hot topic issue, the Republicans will come out in lockstep with voices on the same wavelength. They use clear and simple language with a single antagonist. In the really big battles they even coin phrases like 'Obamacare',…

SOPA is throwing the baby out with the bath water.

(And you never throw the baby out with the bath water!)

Re: I was on BloombergTV talking SOPA today - how'd I do?

#132

Post by zachrose » Thu, Jan 05, 2012, 8:23 AM UTC

DevX101 wrote: post #37

edw519 wrote: post #19

Alexis, you did great. Cool, calm, collected, and sharp. You did a great job advocating what most of us here understand and champion. But here is the problem I see with this whole SOPA debate... I didn't see anything that would help my Uncle Art understand what this is all about in his language and why he should care. This is what he sees: - There is a bill in congress. - It's to stop people from stealing other peopl…

Despite my differences with much of the Republican party platform, one thing that they are damn good at and I respect them for is an ability to communicate with their target base. Where's there's a hot topic issue, the Republicans will come out in lockstep with voices on the same wavelength. They use clear and simple language with a single antagonist. In the really big battles they even coin phrases like 'Obamacare',…

SOPA is throwing the baby out with the bath water.

(And you never throw the baby out with the bath water!)

Re: I was on BloombergTV talking SOPA today - how'd I do?

#133

Post by earbitscom » Thu, Jan 05, 2012, 8:43 AM UTC

DevX101 wrote: post #37

edw519 wrote: post #19

Alexis, you did great. Cool, calm, collected, and sharp. You did a great job advocating what most of us here understand and champion. But here is the problem I see with this whole SOPA debate... I didn't see anything that would help my Uncle Art understand what this is all about in his language and why he should care. This is what he sees: - There is a bill in congress. - It's to stop people from stealing other peopl…

Despite my differences with much of the Republican party platform, one thing that they are damn good at and I respect them for is an ability to communicate with their target base. Where's there's a hot topic issue, the Republicans will come out in lockstep with voices on the same wavelength. They use clear and simple language with a single antagonist. In the really big battles they even coin phrases like 'Obamacare',…

The shoplifting metaphor might be simple and relatable, but it's inaccurate because it's not just someone stealing in your store, it's other people putting stolen merchandise in your store to be re-stolen by someone else.

The real metaphor is, "If you own a pawn shop and let obviously dirt broke people come in and sell you stolen Rolexes all the time, you may be shut down."

Re: I was on BloombergTV talking SOPA today - how'd I do?

#134

Post by earbitscom » Thu, Jan 05, 2012, 8:52 AM UTC

sage_joch wrote: post #113

kn0thing wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes.. I like this. What do you think about this one? http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3426990

I don't think it's a correct analogy, since the copyright infringer isn't doing any possible (or perceived) damage to Disney. I think the pattern should be: "Company X gets shut down because one of its customers broke Law Y at the expense of Company Z". And the best Company X I can think of is a sports franchise. (A customer base that is too large to monitor in real time, and that forms a community that would get shu…

Unfortunately, while you may stumble upon an analogy that describes what could happen to some "poor business", they will all be disingenuous because your analogy leaves out the scenarios that Uncle Art would probably want to see action taken on.

What is happening in many cases is the Boston Red Sox gave the guy selling the Rolexes a booth to sell them in, and directed people searching for "Rolexes" to his booth. The Red Sox hung up ads along the way and made money from all the people who walked past those ads on their way to get Rolexes. Someone reported those Rolexes stolen, so the Red Sox kicked the guy out with no penalty to the guy or the Red Sox, and then let some other fake watch seller setup shop in the same booth. This kept happening for years, and Rolex had to lay off 4000 people, while the Red Sox made a killing.

Re: I was on BloombergTV talking SOPA today - how'd I do?

#135

Post by stcredzero » Thu, Jan 05, 2012, 9:04 AM UTC

edw519 wrote: post #19

Alexis, you did great. Cool, calm, collected, and sharp. You did a great job advocating what most of us here understand and champion. But here is the problem I see with this whole SOPA debate... I didn't see anything that would help my Uncle Art understand what this is all about in his language and why he should care. This is what he sees: - There is a bill in congress. - It's to stop people from stealing other peopl…

There is another comment in this thread by squeee which is the first one I read that my Uncle Art would understand, something like, "If someone shoplifts in your store, this bill allows the government to shut down your store."

Actually, it's more like, if the government gets a tip that someone shoplifted in your store, the government can instantly shut your store down for a long period of time while it gets investigated.

Re: I was on BloombergTV talking SOPA today - how'd I do?

#136

Post by samwillis » Thu, Jan 05, 2012, 9:25 AM UTC

kn0thing wrote: post #107

sage_joch wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A better analogy might abstract away the merits of copyright infringement, and focus on who got punished for that infringement. Maybe something like: "Imagine if the government shut down Walmart because one of its customers was caught handing out ripped Beyonce CDs."

Yes.. I like this. What do you think about this one? http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3426990

I think the annology needs to be as close as posible to relating to "real life" and products and services being infringed. How about:

SOPA is like a law that would allow your local bar to be shut down if some of its customers meet there to swap pirated Music and Films, only the bar is website on-line.

Re: I was on BloombergTV talking SOPA today - how'd I do?

#137

Post by kloc » Thu, Jan 05, 2012, 9:32 AM UTC

Really appreciate what you are doing and you did good. I don't know if other people noticed but I would have preferred you to not smile much( or at all) while listening to her or answering her questions.This could be just my personal preference.Smiling while talking about such a serious issue kind of undermines the seriousness of it a bit.

Re: I was on BloombergTV talking SOPA today - how'd I do?

#138

Post by danssig » Thu, Jan 05, 2012, 9:44 AM UTC

earbitscom wrote: post #133

DevX101 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Despite my differences with much of the Republican party platform, one thing that they are damn good at and I respect them for is an ability to communicate with their target base. Where's there's a hot topic issue, the Republicans will come out in lockstep with voices on the same wavelength. They use clear and simple language with a single antagonist. In the really big battles they even coin phrases like 'Obamacare',…

The shoplifting metaphor might be simple and relatable, but it's inaccurate because it's not just someone stealing in your store, it's other people putting stolen merchandise in your store to be re-stolen by someone else. The real metaphor is, "If you own a pawn shop and let obviously dirt broke people come in and sell you stolen Rolexes all the time, you may be shut down."

No, that's not it either. It's not that your letting people do stuff you know they can't legally be doing. It's that your pawn shop is so incredibly huge that you can't be sure what's happening everywhere at any given time. By the time you get to one side to see what's happened, the other side has turned into Somalia. You put up signs, hire security guards but the floor space is so enormous it would be prohibitively expensive to keep any wrong doers out and trying to do so would cost more than the whole thing is making in revenue.

Re: I was on BloombergTV talking SOPA today - how'd I do?

#139

Post by earbitscom » Thu, Jan 05, 2012, 9:52 AM UTC

danssig wrote: post #138

earbitscom wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The shoplifting metaphor might be simple and relatable, but it's inaccurate because it's not just someone stealing in your store, it's other people putting stolen merchandise in your store to be re-stolen by someone else. The real metaphor is, "If you own a pawn shop and let obviously dirt broke people come in and sell you stolen Rolexes all the time, you may be shut down."

No, that's not it either. It's not that your letting people do stuff you know they can't legally be doing. It's that your pawn shop is so incredibly huge that you can't be sure what's happening everywhere at any given time. By the time you get to one side to see what's happened, the other side has turned into Somalia. You put up signs, hire security guards but the floor space is so enormous it would be prohibitively…

It's not that mine is incorrect. It's that we're both correct, plus a whole other slew of equally plausible scenarios. In plenty of cases it is what I described, plus the owner is painfully aware that his shoppers mostly only buy from the fake watch guys, and they hide behind a description like the one you've crafted, crying "poor me, my job is so hard."

Re: I was on BloombergTV talking SOPA today - how'd I do?

#140

Post by wowtip » Thu, Jan 05, 2012, 10:29 AM UTC

earbitscom wrote: post #133

DevX101 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Despite my differences with much of the Republican party platform, one thing that they are damn good at and I respect them for is an ability to communicate with their target base. Where's there's a hot topic issue, the Republicans will come out in lockstep with voices on the same wavelength. They use clear and simple language with a single antagonist. In the really big battles they even coin phrases like 'Obamacare',…

The shoplifting metaphor might be simple and relatable, but it's inaccurate because it's not just someone stealing in your store, it's other people putting stolen merchandise in your store to be re-stolen by someone else. The real metaphor is, "If you own a pawn shop and let obviously dirt broke people come in and sell you stolen Rolexes all the time, you may be shut down."

I would put i like this:

It is like you own this huge supermarket. Lately some shady guys have started putting flyers with information on where you could buy pirated merchandise from China for cheap.

With SOPA this would mean the Governmnet could shut down _your_ supermarket because someone found one of these flyers at your place.