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Does the world have enough lithium to move to electric vehicles?

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Re: Does the world have enough lithium to move to electric vehicles?

#371

Post by frickenhamster »

0xbadcafebee wrote: post #368
frickenhamster wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This will never work. Components in cars are engineered to be organized as efficiently as possible. The overhead from having replaceable batteries will kill the amount of storage you can have. There is no way you can have generic attendants swap out batteries in 5 minutes. Working with EVs is a dangerous job that you can't just pay an uneducated minimum wage worker to change. The batteries are extremely heavy and are…

> Components in cars are engineered to be organized as efficiently as possible Ever heard of an SUV? Cars are not designed to be efficient, they are designed to meet product goals. Sometimes those goals are efficiency, such as meeting an emissions or efficiency regulation. But most of the goals are "what do we think some schmuck will pay $30K for?" If 100 years ago, replaceable batteries were not a barrier to storage…

SUVs have no relevance to the question. In every EV, and modern cars, the location and layout of every component, especially the battery is a highly engineered process. The battery specifically is not only the most valuable component they need to store as much of as possible, it is the most heavy and most dangerous. Teslas blew up because the battery wasn't stored safely. Store it too high and you risk rollovers. This doesn't even take into account the danger of high amp battery packs being moved around and shared between vehicles. You're oversimplifying a very difficult problem

Re: Does the world have enough lithium to move to electric vehicles?

#372

Post by olivermarks »

wilg wrote: post #367
olivermarks wrote: post #331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Read up on it. There is so much mumbo jumbo about 'global warming' that makes little sense. Tire pollution is a very serious tangible problem.

So your theory is global warming is not a serious tangible problem but tire particulates are?

Pretty much, yes. I think there are sorts of serious flaws in the belief systems that used to be called 'global warming' (which is now renamed 'climate change' as the 'warming' science didn't make sense). Tire particulates are a huge polluting issue, compounded by the disastrous mistakes being made in trying to force heavy electric battery powered vehicles on everyone.

Re: Does the world have enough lithium to move to electric vehicles?

#373

Post by moonchrome »

bertil wrote: post #352
moonchrome wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The electric bike people really need to shut up with the activism. Electric bikes are more unsafe than motorcycles ! This is irregardless of infrastructure (eg. I checked stats in Netherlands which is cyclist utopia according to HN). I used to ride a motorcycle but I would never actively encourage someone to start it - it's just irresponsibly risky. If you chose to do it regardless (like I did) that's your choice - b…

The unsafe part of an e-bike is the cars running people over. I agree with you: we should get rid of that part.

That's not true at all - driving on two wheels is inherently more dangerous, increasingly so the faster you go.

Not to mention that the older/less fit you get the harder it is to react to these situations (tire slipping, hitting holes, stuff hitting you in the face, pedestrians jumping in front of you)

I've said this before - if I put a child seat on a motorcycle I would get social services called instantly. Puting it on an e-bike and I'm a progressive hipster caring about the environment.

The biking propaganda is getting ridiculous.

Re: Does the world have enough lithium to move to electric vehicles?

#374

Post by jgust »

bertil wrote: post #349
jgust wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> e-bicycle with a small roof can ride as long as the Sun shines Is this true? I can go through a 630Wh battery in 2-3 hours of riding and I can't imagine current solar being able to keep up with that. I think you might get an extra ~30 minutes of riding, but not ~forever~ unless you mean pedal power.

Your mileage will vary, but the order of magnitude works: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7EyRqQhuwio

I think you just confirmed for me that you don't know what you're talking about.

Re: Does the world have enough lithium to move to electric vehicles?

#375

Post by pjmlp »

bertil wrote: post #354
pjmlp wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, if one likes to enjoy cold, snow and arrive wet at work during Winter, or sharing body odors during Summertime, also assuming healthy enough to stay on a bicycles or trikes. And yes I know plenty of people do endure weather conditions for their two wheel drive, most never will unless forced to do so.

I live in Umeå, Sweden. Most people here bike. I’m not entirely sure what your point is.

Between the age of 10 and 18 years old, biking was the only way to get anywhere, there were hardly any buses available, didn't had parents to drive me around at the pleasure of my wishes, and no money for taxi.

I know pretty well what it means to cycle everywhere, regardless of weather conditions or not having a place to exchange clothes.

Re: Does the world have enough lithium to move to electric vehicles?

#376

Post by wilg »

olivermarks wrote: post #372
wilg wrote: post #367

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So your theory is global warming is not a serious tangible problem but tire particulates are?

Pretty much, yes. I think there are sorts of serious flaws in the belief systems that used to be called 'global warming' (which is now renamed 'climate change' as the 'warming' science didn't make sense). Tire particulates are a huge polluting issue, compounded by the disastrous mistakes being made in trying to force heavy electric battery powered vehicles on everyone.

OK thanks! I’ll disregard your opinions on the matter.

Re: Does the world have enough lithium to move to electric vehicles?

#377

Post by Gud »

notahacker wrote: post #276
wpm wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please don't conflate British Rail mismanagement with "trains are bad". Your trains are bad. America's trains are bad. They don't have to be. There is a disconnect here with you replying to someone who was talking about the ideal, with your reality. No one is saying train systems in a lot of places, right now, are perfect. We can make them more perfect in addition to moving more freight onto rail, doing more last-mil…

> There is a disconnect here with you replying to someone who was talking about the ideal, with your reality. Their ideal is my reality, because I've never owned a vehicle with more than two wheels and live in a country whose rail density and usage is arguably exceeded only by Japan. So I think I'm pretty well placed to comment on the impracticality of most people forgoing the use of cars altogether in favour of ebik…

The UK rail network sucks. Try taking a train(or tram) in Switzerland.

Re: Does the world have enough lithium to move to electric vehicles?

#378

Post by hedora »

bluedino wrote: post #210
rolenthedeep wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Our cities are designed for cars. Hell, most of our society is designed around owning a car. It is horrendously impractical in a lot of places to go without a car. Our public transit systems are largely garbage, if they exist at all. Bike lanes are extremely rare, and are really just used as free car parking. Take my commute to work for instance. It's about 3 miles, but it would be impossible to bike, as there are hu…

This morning I would have had to bike in the dark, in a 35f rainstorm. Not going to happen.

I've done such things. It is surprisingly not bad if you spend ~$500 on fluorescent breathable rain gear and lights.

The biggest problems are leaves on the stupid green paint they coat the bike lanes with, and increased stopping distance / driver fatigue for the cars.

Storing the rain gear at your destination in a way that lets it dry out is also a big concern.

Being cold is not an issue at all. If anything, you will be too hot while rising.

Re: Does the world have enough lithium to move to electric vehicles?

#379

Post by hedora »

bertil wrote: post #355
option wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, cars plus planes are much more convenient for travel than bikes and trains. That is definitely not to say that there is no place for bikes and trains. US certainly needs more of both. But please stop pretending that a family of 4 can go anywhere on bikes in the weather. Or even going to the beach with all gear in perfect weather. Just not going to happen.

I can assure that anyone in a traffic jam disagrees with you–violently so. More roads aren’t a solution.

More roads are the only solution, and have been for at least 4000 years.

For those 4 millenia, people have gravitated to a 30 minute each way commute, on average.

More roads implies bigger cities and more amenities / economic growth. If bikes mean more people can commute to the city, then they will eventually win.

Re: Does the world have enough lithium to move to electric vehicles?

#380

Post by hedora »

bertil wrote: post #356
fallingknife wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> electric bicycles and trikes like the Aptera are much better direction for the vast majority of individual transport. If it doesn't ever get hot or cold where you live, or ever really rain, then yes. If an ebike works 90% of the time, then I'm getting the car. Might still get the bike, but I also have to have the car, and that will take just as much battery material as if I drive it 100% of the time.

I live in Umeå, Sweden. It was -15ºC today. Most people I saw outside were on bicycles.

Out of curiosity, do ebikes work at all this time of year, or do the batteries freeze? (like they do in inferior EVs)
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