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The skilled trades haven't caught as a career choice with Gen Z

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Re: The skilled trades haven't caught as a career choice with Gen Z

#101
post #87

> America needs carpenters and plumbers. Try telling that to Gen Z Look, as long as we have a market economy, here's how you tell it to Gen Z: raise the wages for carpenters and plumbers (and if necessary shift some of that forward into subsidies and incentives for people to train as carpenters and plumbers) until you get as many as you say you “need”. If America isn’t willing to pay enough to get X carpenters and Y…

There is a psychology problem with skilled trades and younger generates in the US. I've known Gen Z folks who thinks it's better to work at a sandwich shop or small restaurant than skilled trades. They were raised up (through the schooling environment) to look down on trades. Even if it pays them significantly more with better benefits. Many places in the US school system they only prepare people for college. Schools…

> There is a psychology problem with skilled trades and younger generates in the US.

People work preferences not being what you'd like may make the cost of motivating them to behave the way you want higher than you would like.

That’s part of how market’s work—you don’t get to choose other people’s utilitt function. If you “need” for them to act in a particular way, that means you need to offer them a sufficient incentive to do so given their actual utility function, not the utility function you wish they were operating under.

> I've known Gen Z folks who thinks it's better to work at a sandwich shop or small restaurant than skilled trades.

Yes, some people’s subjective preferences aren’t yours or those that would be most convenient for your preferred outcomes.

> This is very much a cultural view of skilled trades.

“Cultural view” is just another way of saying “subjective preference”, and, yes, that’s how utility functions work.

Blame whatever you want, Gen Z is mostly a little late for changes to parenting or schooling policies, even if one had a set in mind and the power to wish it into being, to shift this much, so, the bottom line still is, if you want to “tell Gen Z” about your perceived “need” for more tradespeople, you need to do it through sufficient incentives giving their actual values and preferences.

Re: The skilled trades haven't caught as a career choice with Gen Z

#102

Tradespeople will be the new software engineers in the late 2020s through 2030s. Enough that I'm considering leaving my cushy FAANG engineering manager job to become an electrician. On top of the huge supply shortage, consider that the majority of the U.S. housing stock was built during the Baby Boom suburbanization from 1950-1970, and that the average lifespan of a house's internal systems (plumbing, electrical) is…

Nah, tradespeople will be replaced with lego buildings, the same way that furniture makers were replaced with ikea

Re: The skilled trades haven't caught as a career choice with Gen Z

#103
post #65

"We need more tradespeople" seems to be an evergreen news article. My brother in law is an electrician. He is paid alright, enough to live on. But there are HUGE downsides. He does not receive health insurance. He does not get paid vacation. In order to match decent white-collar pay, he needs to work overtime. His company pushes hard to get jobs finished fast, causing people to cut safety corners. Many of his coworke…

It's not going to get more attractive. This is where some imaginative immigration policies can help.

By imaginative, do you mean restrictive?

Re: The skilled trades haven't caught as a career choice with Gen Z

#104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My uncles a roofer and did it into his 40s but eventually started his own company when he wanted to stop carrying slate around on roofs in the miserable British winters. I think that's the usual progression - you're not literally laying tiles till you're 67.

Relying on entrepreneurship for your livelihood and retirement as you age sounds like it'll only work for a select few

Unless there is massive population growth. Single older person can employ only so many juniors. Or other older people have to exit the market.

Re: The skilled trades haven't caught as a career choice with Gen Z

#105
post #7

[flagged]

I might be misunderstanding what you're saying but are you implying that journalists are somehow responsible for fixing the issues they report on?

that does not follow from the parent comment. it's more of "they are making the problem worse" by (presumably) sending their kids to liberal arts or theoretical studies

Re: The skilled trades haven't caught as a career choice with Gen Z

#106
I’m a so called “blue collar worker” - I supervise the installation of high voltage equipment. I make pretty good money - seems few people want to travel as much as I do. Most sites I work at, the guys are mostly freelancers. They make about €100/h, pre taxes.

Re: The skilled trades haven't caught as a career choice with Gen Z

#107
post #27

It's almost as if people are less willing to work jobs that actively harm their long-term physical health (back-breaking jobs) or those harmful for their mental health (generally ones face to face with customers, customer support or high stress jobs), for a relatively small wage to said job's demands and lasting effects.

Where are you finding small wage plumbers or carpenters? All the trades here (plumbing, electrical, HVAC, carpentry (perhaps more on the finish side vs framing though) are extremely expensive, with hourly rates between $80-$150/hour. (source - did a lot of renovations on my house, and my BIL is an electrician).

And how many billable hours there are on average in a month? Does the rate include tools or some of the materials?

Re: The skilled trades haven't caught as a career choice with Gen Z

#108
post #89

A lot of these threads devolve into "have you tried paying more" but I'd also like to highlight "have you actually tried telling Gen Z that". I'm 35, from basically as early as I can remember until sophmore year of college I was told constantly by every adult (and I mean every adult not just the ones that had degrees) in my life to go to college, get a degree, any degree. So yeah I went to college. It was aggressivel…

Many adults were told college was the only way to go. Those who went through college and those who didn't. Doesn't matter the debt. It's always better. Except it's not. First, society is going to have too few skilled trades folks in the coming years due to people retiring and not being replaced. Second, a lot of college degrees can't get someone a good job. I remember someone telling me they had a business degree and…

A business degree makes the candidate over-qualified for managing a mall store is the likely reason. They are afraid of the employee using the position as a stepping stone to a higher paying, higher status job.

Re: The skilled trades haven't caught as a career choice with Gen Z

#109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’d be surprised. Sometimes quality of life is better spent not working when you can lean on family and friends Or your own small retirement fund. Not saying someone’s life choices are right or wrong one way or the other in this case. I’m very grateful for my position but would be lying if I didn’t say I day dreamt occasionally about quitting work and living like a backpacker.

>Sometimes quality of life is better spent not working when you can lean on family and friends Or your own small retirement fund. And then when enough do, and the result becomes a lifetime of un/under-employment, then they want the retirements or lives of those before or around them, who do you think will pick up the slack? Sure, quit and be a backpacker. Doing it a while is fun, probably even healthy, but a lifetime…

I mean, if enough enough refusing to enter the rat race makes society hurts, maybe a new way of social organization will be creted?

Re: The skilled trades haven't caught as a career choice with Gen Z

#110

Tradespeople will be the new software engineers in the late 2020s through 2030s. Enough that I'm considering leaving my cushy FAANG engineering manager job to become an electrician. On top of the huge supply shortage, consider that the majority of the U.S. housing stock was built during the Baby Boom suburbanization from 1950-1970, and that the average lifespan of a house's internal systems (plumbing, electrical) is…

Tradespeople will definitely not be making 300k+ off a few years of experience five years from now.

And if they were, who could afford to pay them that? Other tradespeople? Ultra-rich?
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