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Amazon has raised the number of jobs it plans to cut 18,000

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Re: Amazon has raised the number of jobs it plans to cut 18,000

#51

Post by shmatt »

noodle wrote: post #47
shmatt wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Making profits does not have to mean funding teams that aren't generating anything significant in terms or product and/or income. Many of these companies have a small portion making most of the profits, and all the others eating them up (see: VR, Voice). You can do it the Amazon way, cutting products that are bleeding money, or the Salesforce way asking all units to cut 10% across the board, but just keeping failed p…

If they were making record profits, they would be looking to expand their profitable divisions, would they not? They would likely not lay people off, but reorganize internally to move resources away from failing areas and into the clearly thriving, very profitable areas; or start something completely new. Hiring one good employee is expensive and difficult.

I feel like im stating the obvious but you can't just double the headcount on AWS and expect AWS profits to double

The profitable divisions are probably still hiring, and there might be an option for some of the 18,000 to interview internally before getting terminated, some companies gave that option (30 day internal interview deadline). But you can't just move 3,000 Alexa employees to AWS and expect things to go smoothly

Re: Amazon has raised the number of jobs it plans to cut 18,000

#52

Post by jesuscript »

deltree7 wrote: post #36
honestduane wrote: post #26

This is just corporate gaslighting at this point; There is no legitimate reason so many very profitable tech companies need to fire so many when we are not even in a recession according to the United States Government and the treasury and the banks, and its not like they are not making record profits. They cant say "we are making record profits" and in the same breath say "we need to fire people to survive" that's no…

This is a very naive take. When I invest in Amazon or any other company, I expect Amazon to invest in projects that give me a rate of return that exceeds the 4% that I can easily get from Treasury. If it can't, Amazon better return my money. Also, Amazon can't hoard employees that aren't being productive. It is better those employees work for startups and other endeavors. individually, it sucks short-time, but as a n…

Well, it has long been argued that stock buy back is an indicator a company that doesn’t know how to invest into its own r&d. Not to say that Amazon is the type of company that doesn’t know where to move it’s people, perhaps they don’t know at the moment and would rather save on the labor.

Unless your company is in financial hardship, ditching headcount is similar to a stock buy back. You don’t know how to invest the money, and you don’t know how to invest the people - yet.

Re: Amazon has raised the number of jobs it plans to cut 18,000

#53

Post by jacobsenscott »

throwawayxy1 wrote: post #32
honestduane wrote: post #26

This is just corporate gaslighting at this point; There is no legitimate reason so many very profitable tech companies need to fire so many when we are not even in a recession according to the United States Government and the treasury and the banks, and its not like they are not making record profits. They cant say "we are making record profits" and in the same breath say "we need to fire people to survive" that's no…

Why would any company fire anybody if they are generating money for them?

To drive down wages. All tech companies firing thousands of people at the same time is a simple way to do this. Hire back in a year at much reduced salaries and benefits.

Re: Amazon has raised the number of jobs it plans to cut 18,000

#54

Post by 0x4974h »

mc32 wrote: post #49
honestduane wrote: post #26

This is just corporate gaslighting at this point; There is no legitimate reason so many very profitable tech companies need to fire so many when we are not even in a recession according to the United States Government and the treasury and the banks, and its not like they are not making record profits. They cant say "we are making record profits" and in the same breath say "we need to fire people to survive" that's no…

According to Joe Biden, we've been in a recession for two years. But even if he was imprecise as he is wont to be, the Fed is saying there is a slowdown. Companies are not going to wait till they are near bankruptcy to lay people off. Yes, they overhired but also those people hired got experience and a job. They may have instead landed a different job paying less (otherwise they would not have taken this job) or they…

> Yes, they overhired but also those people hired got experience and a job.

Do you have any idea how much stress and strain this can put on a person, especially if they are the provider for their family?

Please don't make excuses for one of the richest companies in the world abusing their position and treating human beings like expendible machines.

Re: Amazon has raised the number of jobs it plans to cut 18,000

#55

Post by roflyear »

honestduane wrote: post #26

This is just corporate gaslighting at this point; There is no legitimate reason so many very profitable tech companies need to fire so many when we are not even in a recession according to the United States Government and the treasury and the banks, and its not like they are not making record profits. They cant say "we are making record profits" and in the same breath say "we need to fire people to survive" that's no…

How do we define recession?

Re: Amazon has raised the number of jobs it plans to cut 18,000

#56

Post by Sakos »

simplotek wrote: post #38
throwawayxy1 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would any company fire anybody if they are generating money for them?

> Why would any company fire anybody if they are generating money for them? Amazon has been cutting teams that either could not justify their existence or worked in money-losing investments. Alexa was a very public project getting the axe.

I still don't understand why they axed Alexa. It doesn't make any sense to me in the context of the rest of their business.

Re: Amazon has raised the number of jobs it plans to cut 18,000

#57

Post by roflyear »

deltree7 wrote: post #36
honestduane wrote: post #26

This is just corporate gaslighting at this point; There is no legitimate reason so many very profitable tech companies need to fire so many when we are not even in a recession according to the United States Government and the treasury and the banks, and its not like they are not making record profits. They cant say "we are making record profits" and in the same breath say "we need to fire people to survive" that's no…

This is a very naive take. When I invest in Amazon or any other company, I expect Amazon to invest in projects that give me a rate of return that exceeds the 4% that I can easily get from Treasury. If it can't, Amazon better return my money. Also, Amazon can't hoard employees that aren't being productive. It is better those employees work for startups and other endeavors. individually, it sucks short-time, but as a n…

Amazon can't horde the employees, but I would expect them to be more responsible than save up for massive layoffs.

Re: Amazon has raised the number of jobs it plans to cut 18,000

#58

Post by mc32 »

0x4974h wrote: post #54
mc32 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to Joe Biden, we've been in a recession for two years. But even if he was imprecise as he is wont to be, the Fed is saying there is a slowdown. Companies are not going to wait till they are near bankruptcy to lay people off. Yes, they overhired but also those people hired got experience and a job. They may have instead landed a different job paying less (otherwise they would not have taken this job) or they…

> Yes, they overhired but also those people hired got experience and a job. Do you have any idea how much stress and strain this can put on a person, especially if they are the provider for their family? Please don't make excuses for one of the richest companies in the world abusing their position and treating human beings like expendible machines.

I know it's hard. I don't wish it --but at the same time many people _got_ jobs _because_ companies overhired. Had they not, then many people would have had no job at all or would have had to take lesser jobs. Just imagine 25% tech across the board if they had kept their belts tight. How many people would have not gotten that tech job over the last two to three years? That would suck even more.

Re: Amazon has raised the number of jobs it plans to cut 18,000

#59

Post by P_I_Staker »

noodle wrote: post #47
shmatt wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Making profits does not have to mean funding teams that aren't generating anything significant in terms or product and/or income. Many of these companies have a small portion making most of the profits, and all the others eating them up (see: VR, Voice). You can do it the Amazon way, cutting products that are bleeding money, or the Salesforce way asking all units to cut 10% across the board, but just keeping failed p…

If they were making record profits, they would be looking to expand their profitable divisions, would they not? They would likely not lay people off, but reorganize internally to move resources away from failing areas and into the clearly thriving, very profitable areas; or start something completely new. Hiring one good employee is expensive and difficult.

Yeah, unless you see this as a cheap opportunity to slurp up talent and ditch anyone that's seen as a "problem".

Re: Amazon has raised the number of jobs it plans to cut 18,000

#60

Post by roflyear »

jesuscript wrote: post #52
deltree7 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a very naive take. When I invest in Amazon or any other company, I expect Amazon to invest in projects that give me a rate of return that exceeds the 4% that I can easily get from Treasury. If it can't, Amazon better return my money. Also, Amazon can't hoard employees that aren't being productive. It is better those employees work for startups and other endeavors. individually, it sucks short-time, but as a n…

Well, it has long been argued that stock buy back is an indicator a company that doesn’t know how to invest into its own r&d. Not to say that Amazon is the type of company that doesn’t know where to move it’s people, perhaps they don’t know at the moment and would rather save on the labor. Unless your company is in financial hardship, ditching headcount is similar to a stock buy back. You don’t know how to invest the…

More likely, poor management due to growth incentives caused a lot of unnecessary hires and now's an opportune time to do layoffs.
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