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‘Breakthrough’ obesity drugs that have stunned researchers

nature.com

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Re: ‘Breakthrough’ obesity drugs that have stunned researchers

#221

Post by mattbrewsbytes »

iammjm wrote: post #20

At a risk of being ignorant: Isn’t obesity a function of calories intake and calories burn rate? If so, why do we even need a drug for that? What should a possible drug target here? Assuming no changes in behaviour and thus a continued steady daily caloric surplus, would it even work?

I had an opinion that this all sounded silly but then watched the 60 Minutes segment on the drugs and what the doc talked about is, in my layman's recollection, the body remembers its weight and wants to get back to that which is why a lot of people end up losing and then gaining most of it back. Genetics play a role in this, I forget how but something to do with what these drugs help change.

I wonder if rather than a placebo they had a control group also try to lose with caloric restriction and defined plateaus where they maintain a weight for some period of time. For example instead of lose 1lb/week for 52 weeks, lose 1lb/week for 12 weeks, maintain weight for 8 weeks, repeat. Maybe the element of the body "remembering" a weight happens when you plateau at a weight for a while? Kinda like giving the body some time to adjust as you lose.

Re: ‘Breakthrough’ obesity drugs that have stunned researchers

#222

Post by Cupertino95014 »

> “I’m really hesitant to be excited about something that I think is potentially harmful from a weight stigma perspective,” says Sarah Nutter, a psychologist at the University of Victoria in Canada, who specializes in weight stigma and body image.

Putting the word "stigma" on things is a sure sign of a grifter. Instead of helping solve it, they're trying to make it a social science problem.

Being overweight is unhealthy. There's no serious dispute about that. So people recognizing that fact is "stigma?"

Re: ‘Breakthrough’ obesity drugs that have stunned researchers

#223

Post by whodatbo1 »

bioemerl wrote: post #182

> In the past, scientists and the public often thought that those with obesity simply lacked the willpower to lose weight. But evidence is growing that most people’s bodies have a natural size that can be hard to change. In the context where we have gone from obesity rates of 13 percent to 40, to suggest that people have a natural weight and that's the cause of this seems absurd to me.

Absolutely agree. Unironically through the first few paragraphs I though this was some very cleverly put satirical take on modern society. There is a great book about the effects of modern food, primarily on dental health, written back in the 30s - Nutrition and Physical Degeneration by Weston Price. Even though it's almost a century old, the findings are quite fascinating and can be extrapolated to present day. It's quite undeniable that modern life has drawbacks and obesity is just a symptom.

Re: ‘Breakthrough’ obesity drugs that have stunned researchers

#224

Post by fxtentacle »

viro wrote: post #190
bioemerl wrote: post #182

> In the past, scientists and the public often thought that those with obesity simply lacked the willpower to lose weight. But evidence is growing that most people’s bodies have a natural size that can be hard to change. In the context where we have gone from obesity rates of 13 percent to 40, to suggest that people have a natural weight and that's the cause of this seems absurd to me.

And it makes more logical sense to you that everyone is just weak-willed?

s/weak-willed/addicted/

There. Fixed it for you :) Yes, to me it seems like capitalism creates a society where most people get addicted just trying to cope with everyday life. For some it's alcohol, for some it's OxyContin, for some it's food, for some it's all-nighters in World of Warcraft.

"59.3 million (21.4%) people over age 12 used illicit drugs in the past year."

"Underage [..] 29% reported drinking alcohol"

https://www.verywellmind.com/rates-of-illicit-drug-abuse-in-...

Looks like weed and alcohol already are 50% of all citizens... I don't find it difficult to imagine that the other half ab-uses food.

Re: ‘Breakthrough’ obesity drugs that have stunned researchers

#225

Post by joe_the_user »

dougmwne wrote: post #162
iammjm wrote: post #20

At a risk of being ignorant: Isn’t obesity a function of calories intake and calories burn rate? If so, why do we even need a drug for that? What should a possible drug target here? Assuming no changes in behaviour and thus a continued steady daily caloric surplus, would it even work?

Yes, your instinct is correct, you have vastly oversimplified it in an unhelpful way. The body is not an energy equation to be balanced. The desire to eat is driven by our hormones and these are not easily overridden by willpower. In fact, study after study shows that willpower is insufficient for most people. Hunger is produced by a complex set of factors that we do not fully understand. What we eat and how we live…

It's very important to consider "metabolic rate" in these considerations. I have been nearly under-weight my entire life (I'm in my 60s) and I've eaten as much high-calorie food I've felt similarly, usually a large amount (generally consuming the most any gathering I'm at, etc, eating three meal a day, etc).

The one thing I've always done is avoid foods with added sugar and in general processed food. There's good evidence that the consumption of "ultra-processed" food is associated with the obesity epidemic and that these food are what people weight-maintenance processes out of balance.

Given this, adding a drug to solve that problem might not be a panacea. What other bad effects could result from a strong drug plus a crap diet? We'll start another mass experiment to find, I suppose.

Re: ‘Breakthrough’ obesity drugs that have stunned researchers

#226

Post by kenjackson »

drdeca wrote: post #161
kenjackson wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't all food addictive? Is there something more specific you mean about addition when it comes to these foods? It seems like it may be more about caloric density than addiction.

In what sense is "all food addictive"? If you just mean "if you don't eat, you die", I don't think that qualifies as an addiction. If you mean "if you suddenly eat a lot more for some meal than you usually do, you will likely be more hungry the next day than usual", I also don't think that really qualifies. It's not the same kind of thing?

It's not just "if you don't eat, you die". It's that you have a strong yearning to eat. Now that's probably an evolutionary adaptation to "if you don't eat, you die", but nevertheless I want to eat pretty consistently every day. Again, how is that different than a nicotine addiction? The only difference is that if I don't smoke, I won't die...

Re: ‘Breakthrough’ obesity drugs that have stunned researchers

#227

Post by nextlevelwizard »

thejackgoode wrote: post #176

How many of obesity cases are caused by eating disorders and addiction psyche in general? Treating the symptom in this case barely helps. You might lose weight, but it'll pop up in some other place in your life. See it as psychological side effect, a swap of coping mechanism. Often enough, IMO you need to go deeper than a pill.

Thats such bullshit. Sure, yes, there is 100% mental aspect to every obese person, but some of that shit is old and already dealt with, but since you are already fucked you cant get out from the cycle.

Of course we should deal with the mental side but it will be a million times easier to deal with after you aren’t a fat fuck.

Re: ‘Breakthrough’ obesity drugs that have stunned researchers

#228

Post by rayiner »

yamtaddle wrote: post #214
0xB31B1B wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, if you have perfect bloodwork and a marvel movie body probably not necessary but otherwise yes. Heart disease, hypertension, high cholesterol, colon cancer rates are rising amongst everyone, even thin people. These drugs positively impact indicators of these things in everyone. Longevity makers have been betting on metformin for a long time and these drugs are like a supercharged metformin

> these drugs are like a supercharged metformin No drinking alcohol, like metformin? If so, I suspect you could get a large fraction of the improvement gained from a population-wide deployment of these drugs, at zero cost , if everyone just stopped drinking alcohol. "But that's unreasonable!" Right, so if that's also required for taking this drug, then....

My whole family mostly avoids alcohol (Muslim) and lots of people are overweight.

Re: ‘Breakthrough’ obesity drugs that have stunned researchers

#230

Post by mym1990 »

imranq wrote: post #164
rajin444 wrote: post #56

This drug is a net good for society, but we have to fix the root problem. Much of the food we eat is filled with addictive ingredients (sugar, excess fats/oils, etc) that provide little nutritional value but are highly addictive. We’re subsidizing companies that create unhealthy addictive food and subsidizing companies to create drugs to counter the unhealthy addictive food. This is an enormous waste of resources.

I agree that we have incredible waste on both sides, but there is an even greater culprit: people are lacking true meaning and purpose in their lives and are indulging in these foods to distract themselves from their inner emptiness.

This is a pretty big leap, what is even "true meaning and purpose"? The culprit is that this food is literally everywhere and billions of dollars are poured into research everywhere to design systems that entice humans to take the convenient way out. If I was to go along with your hypothesis, I would alter it to say that poor nutrition is what contributes to a person's lack of "true meaning and purpose".
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