Live data from Hacker News

How to Participate in Hacker News

edweissman.com

91–100 of 126 posts

Re: How to Participate in Hacker News

#91

I particularly like this example, which the author acknowledges is extreme: "3. Be positive. "This can really be hard when smart people debate, but try it anyway. Notice the difference between: "Person A: Water is dry. "Person B: No it's not. You're full of shit. "and "Person C: Water is dry. "Person D: Not in my experience. What data have you encountered to cause you to arrive at that conclusion?" I really like thos…

I initially interpreted that as "and other news aggregates like HN out there?" Oh, my silly brain...

But seriously, are there any other awesome news aggregates that I should be aware of?

Re: How to Participate in Hacker News

#92
post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the contrary, I think people should flag away -- but go to the new stories page first. There's plenty of spam and politics and duplicate content and other off-topic humdrum. And if you happen to come across an interesting article about hacking or startups, vote it up -- it might even make it to the front page.

Not sure if you know this or not, but flagging an article as it first appears prevents all other HNers from seeing it. Flagging it later on causes it to sink rapidly off the top page. This means that a very few people could prevent huge chunks of legitimate stories from being seen by fellow HNers by flagging. Flagging, for whatever reason, is much more powerful than voting. If you flag, you not only note that the art…

This is a bit worrying. It's very easy to accidentally hit flag when using a mobile device; The links are all very small and close together, and there is no confirmation dialogue.

Re: How to Participate in Hacker News

#93
post #68

2. Participate! I often participate, but when I don't it's usually for a simple reason: downvotes sting. This is so important that I would add it as a corollary to "9. Be nice": 9a. Use downvotes sparingly. I and my poor primate brain will thank you.

  > when I don't it's usually for a simple reason:
  > downvotes sting
They do. But recently I am trying to use it as an opportunity to learn not to care too much what do random (or semi-random) people think about your opinion. Yep, someone will downvote. Not a big deal it is not like someone is hitting you on the head.I don't mean one should ignore all downvotes because sometimes it is healthy to think why are you really downvoted, but quite often downovtes come as a result of knee-jerk reaction, group-think or because someone just does not like you. That's another thing to learn: resist the urge to write "I know I will be downvoted for this". If you write this (of follow-up comment "why am I being downvoted?") you will be, by me, at least :)

Re: How to Participate in Hacker News

#94

Here's another suggestion: flag sparingly. A lot of long-time HN'ers are frustrated at the "flag patrols" -- people of one group who don't like such-and-such author and flag them and their submissions. I've heard several people complain to me about having normal articles flagged and I've done my share of complaining. Don't be the guy who takes out your personal grudges in the form of flagging. Let the votes work. The…

Daniel, I know you mean well, but your suggestion of "flag sparingly" is only useful some of the time, and there is code in place to handle those who flag excessively. As always, there's more to it than meets the eye.

There is a great deal of "secret sauce" running on HN, and to prevent adversaries from abusing HN for their own gain, PG deliberately does not publicly divulge how a lot of things work. [1] You would need to have either a deep fascination with discussion forums, or far too much free time (probably both) to figure out some of the non-public details of how HN really works. If one really does their homework well and figures out some of the details, hopefully they have enough respect for PG, YC and all of the folks using HN to not abuse or divulge what they learn.

Though the precise details are not public information, pg has publicly stated that he does have some form of (vote/flag) "ring detection" running here on HN to thwart group and/or multi-account manipulation. [2] Since the details are not public, there is really no way to know how effective the ring detection is, but suffice to say, if it wasn't an improvement, it wouldn't exist.

When it comes to flagging and up-voting of submissions, the publicly described logic is both clever and fascinating. If you flag heavily up-voted submissions, your flags count less. Similarly, if you flag too many things (and most likely, too quickly), your flags count less. In other words, there are thresholds employed. [3,4]

When it comes to flagging comments, I can't recall seeing any mention of how the comment flags are handled, and worse, there's nothing in my notes about it. Considering the potential for abuse, I doubt PG will ever give vague details about it. Spam comments are an interesting problem, and it's very difficult to solve. Allowing users to flag comments is one way to handle it, but divulging the details would most likely reduce the effectiveness of the counter-measures.

There is still one place on HN where doing a lot of flagging and up-voting of submissions is both useful and beneficial to HN as a whole, namely, on the "new" page: https://news.ycombinator.com/newest

I'm sure many people appreciate the high signal to noise ratio here on HN, and would rather avoid the more noisy /newest page. None the less, people putting in some time to both flag spam and give up-votes to new submissions is what keeps the high signal to noise on the front page.

Yes, even if you're just flagging spam on the /newest page, you can still trigger the "excessive flagger" threshold, and the result is (was?) the "flag" links disappear. I had it happen to me once a long time ago, but since then, I believe the system was changed to simply not count the flags once a user has passed the threshold value. I would bet a human being (pg or a moderator) looks at any account that flags too much to determine if the account should be banned, hell banned, deleted, or whatever. If they see that you're really just trying to flag the endless spam submissions, they probably just quietly appreciate your efforts. I've never received a gilded thank you note for flagging spam submissions, and I don't expect to get one, but I'm sure everyone who likes the high signal to noise ratio around here appreciates it.

NOTE: Though the references below are from PG himself, it's entirely possible that he's changed his mind, and his code, since they were originally posted.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=830838

[2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3354900

[3] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=830485

[4] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=830531

Re: How to Participate in Hacker News

#95
post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's more that there are large numbers of people who consistently don't get humour, either for cultural reasons or deficiencies in their humour glands or whatever. On the other hand, in forums where people upvote humour, there can be mechanisms that actually are counterproductive. E.g. on Reddit where there is something serious that you are interested in, but some idiot starts a punning thread which takes off and run…

I don't think that downvotes necessarily mean that people didn't get the joke. If I see a witty one-liner comment to a serious story, my normal reaction is "Ha ha ha! Downvote." Or else I ignore it entirely. (And sometimes it simply _isn't_ very funny.) I just don't think we need to encourage content-free comments here; there are plenty of places to go if you want to make fun of the news. Then again, I moderate a sit…

The problem I have is the inconsistency. I remember posting a sarcastic comment in a sea of sarcasting comments, then saying 'seriously though' and adding genuine content. Mine was the only comment that went gray. I've seen this stuff time and time again with other users - several comments of fluff, but only one gets pounded. What gets pounded in one thread gets rewarded in others - sometimes I'll post a snarky, devoid-of-content comment, hit post, and then wonder just how fast it will go dead and next thing I know it's really popular. It really is inconsistent, and that bugs me.

Re: How to Participate in Hacker News

#96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure if you know this or not, but flagging an article as it first appears prevents all other HNers from seeing it. Flagging it later on causes it to sink rapidly off the top page. This means that a very few people could prevent huge chunks of legitimate stories from being seen by fellow HNers by flagging. Flagging, for whatever reason, is much more powerful than voting. If you flag, you not only note that the art…

This is a bit worrying. It's very easy to accidentally hit flag when using a mobile device; The links are all very small and close together, and there is no confirmation dialogue.

If you flag something by mistake, you can 'unflag' it. The 'flag' link turns into an 'unflag' link.

I believe there is a time-limit on how long you have the ability to 'unflag' something. I believe the time limit is similar to being able to edit or delete your comments for a 2 hour period after you made them.

Re: How to Participate in Hacker News

#97
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

HN has a really bizzare, inconsistent relationship with humour. Best to avoid it altogether.

It's more that there are large numbers of people who consistently don't get humour, either for cultural reasons or deficiencies in their humour glands or whatever. On the other hand, in forums where people upvote humour, there can be mechanisms that actually are counterproductive. E.g. on Reddit where there is something serious that you are interested in, but some idiot starts a punning thread which takes off and run…

I really hate the downmod system here, but you can see my further complaints in my profile rather than repeat them again.

But I wanted to respond to this: now that HN de-emphsises karma

I don't think it de-emphasises karma much at all. On every single page of HN you view, your karma is there in high-contrast lettering right next to your handle. It's also not quite pointless as there are several features that get unlocked by high karma. I'd love to see the user's karma score banished from everywhere but their profile page. I don't want to be reminded that I have a score on every page visit.

On the humour thing, it's not that I don't see humour on the site, it's that the same humour can be punished or rewarded depending on the alignment of the planets or whatever.

Re: How to Participate in Hacker News

#98
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting perspective. What data led you to that conclusion?

The ironies that lie is this ^^ post… In all seriousness, humor on HN needs to be: 1) Actually funny; it can't an obvious pun or cliché. 2) Constructive; humor *can* convey and add to meaning. 3) Clean and nice; this should go without saying.

He was also quoting from the article.

Re: How to Participate in Hacker News

#99
post #11

one of the main reasons i think people don't participate is because of the language, a lot of us are very good at reading english but are ashamed about our writing skills. Its very common to be downvoted or insulted because of that, im trying to get pass that problem right now

I know it shouldn't be necessary, but I would recommend adding a disclaimer to your posts explaining that english isn't your first language or simply that you apologize for and spelling mistakes. People are much more likely, for whatever reason, to dismiss mistakes when the possibility of such is explicitly acknowledged by the author.

i have seen that before, i always thought people would find that annoying.. but ill give it a try, thanks!

Re: How to Participate in Hacker News

#100
post #68

2. Participate! I often participate, but when I don't it's usually for a simple reason: downvotes sting. This is so important that I would add it as a corollary to "9. Be nice": 9a. Use downvotes sparingly. I and my poor primate brain will thank you.

> when I don't it's usually for a simple reason: > downvotes sting They do. But recently I am trying to use it as an opportunity to learn not to care too much what do random (or semi-random) people think about your opinion. Yep, someone will downvote. Not a big deal it is not like someone is hitting you on the head.I don't mean one should ignore all downvotes because sometimes it is healthy to think why are you reall…

I agree. Alas, my poor primate brain is often not so easily assuaged. But your attitude of viewing downvotes as an opportunity is very much in line with Stoic philosophy—an attitude, I think, worth cultivating.
Post reply on HN