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The privatization of policing

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Re: The privatization of policing

#121

Post by danuker »

pmarreck wrote: post #94
pixl97 wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What, you did not answer his question, and came up with some gibberish. https://www.epi.org/publication/employers-steal-billions-fro... >What this report finds: This report assesses the prevalence and magnitude of one form of wage theft—minimum wage violations (workers being paid at an effective hourly rate below the binding minimum wage)—in the 10 most populous U.S. states. We find that, in these states, 2.4 million…

Ah, sorry, I thought they were angling at the "taxation is theft" libertarian thing. Was not aware of this separate and unfortunate phenomenon.

Cheers!

Re: The privatization of policing

#122

Post by pmarreck »

pleasantpeasant wrote: post #105
pmarreck wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

You're putting in a lot of words in my mouth and it's a bit weird how aggressive you're coming off here. There's nothing I'm proposing here at all. I'm only critical of the obvious pro-private militarized police force, which every American should be. And this article is blatant propaganda for that agenda. The author herself works at The Federalist Society, a far-right conservative magazine.

I didn't see much particularly pro- about it, other than the fact that they seem more focused on treating people like people and not like case numbers. Was that part not true?

Re: The privatization of policing

#123

Post by wahnfrieden »

culi wrote: post #107
pmarreck wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

because taxation to fund a public good is not theft in your world there are only private security firms. if you're not up to date on your dues, oh well, they'll happily watch you get robbed I guess. EDIT: I was unaware of the "wage theft" problem and assumed this was angling at "taxation is theft," my bad

GP was pointing out that things like wage theft is a much bigger priority over petty shoplifting. The combined value of all robberies (shoplifting, mugging, etc) in 2012 was $341 million while wage theft alone accounts for $933 million yet we spend far more trying to prevent the former and hardly do anything to prevent the latter which primarily affects minimum wage workers https://www.epi.org/publication/wage-theft-…

Wage theft is estimated at $15 billion annually in US per US government reporting

Re: The privatization of policing

#124

Post by n8cpdx »

djinnandtonic wrote: post #3

There's a lot wrong here: 1. Don't conflate business interests with the interests of the population of a city. I don't doubt there is rising demand for private armed security from the 1% of Portlanders who own businesses, that does not reflect on everyone. 2. Portland has seen rising violent crime but this is part regression to the mean (Portland is the safest city of it's size, even after the 2020 spike) and part of…

Portland had 96 homicides in 2022. San Francisco had 55 and Seattle had ~50. Both of those cities are much larger than Portland.

But ignoring homicides traffic violence is at a 70 year high after the traffic policing team was cut to support homicide investigation and patrol. https://www.koin.com/news/portland/portland-sees-rise-in-ped...

Re: The privatization of policing

#125

Post by s1artibartfast »

wahnfrieden wrote: post #79
phpisthebest wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>hey've been unaccountable to the public, they've lied about what people do (pretending they've attacked them), they've lied about their use of force, and attacked people in tents to displace them. So a normal police force then? This is a natural reaction when property crime goes unenforced by the government. I know this will be an unpopular take but property crime like shoplifting is not a "victimless" crime agains…

[flagged]

I often hear this whataboutism and am not sure why.

Do you see the problems or solutions somehow in competition?

Can people not care about two things?

Re: The privatization of policing

#126

Post by culi »

wahnfrieden wrote: post #123
culi wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GP was pointing out that things like wage theft is a much bigger priority over petty shoplifting. The combined value of all robberies (shoplifting, mugging, etc) in 2012 was $341 million while wage theft alone accounts for $933 million yet we spend far more trying to prevent the former and hardly do anything to prevent the latter which primarily affects minimum wage workers https://www.epi.org/publication/wage-theft-…

Wage theft is estimated at $15 billion annually in US per US government reporting

I suppose it depends how you count

https://laborstandards.sccgov.org/impact-issues/wage-theft

I think the important bit is the ratio between wage theft and other forms of theft. Whichever way you slice it you basically get the same conclusion

Re: The privatization of policing

#127

Post by brk »

wahnfrieden wrote: post #79
phpisthebest wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>hey've been unaccountable to the public, they've lied about what people do (pretending they've attacked them), they've lied about their use of force, and attacked people in tents to displace them. So a normal police force then? This is a natural reaction when property crime goes unenforced by the government. I know this will be an unpopular take but property crime like shoplifting is not a "victimless" crime agains…

[flagged]

Property theft and wage theft are two very different categories of theft. The average police department does not get involved in wage theft, which would be something more involving lawyers, maybe ultimately leading to an arrest warrant carried out by a police force.

And of course this is another example of an "AND" decision, not an "OR" one. We can enforce and prosecute property theft crimes, which absolutely needs to happen, while simultaneously pursuing wage theft prosecution.

Re: The privatization of policing

#128

Post by nemo44x »

mikrl wrote: post #109
nemo44x wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hope they stay. The last thing anyone wants is for them to leave the hellholes they voted for and turn nice places into new versions of them. I know many people in places like Austin and Boise are very nervous about the types of people moving in and not picking up on local values.

>I know many people in places like Austin and Boise are very nervous about the types of people moving in and not picking up on local values. This sounds like knee jerk nativism. How many people would it take to move and overwhelm an entire city’s culture? Let’s assume a plurality of 30% could do it. I think a wave of people of that size is going to cause problems whatever their political beliefs are.

Austin saw a 33% increase in the decade ending in 2020 (after 38% the previous decade) and it hasn’t let up. Around 8% of Austin’s residents lived somewhere else the previous year.

Re: The privatization of policing

#130

Post by [deleted] »

wahnfrieden wrote: post #79
phpisthebest wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>hey've been unaccountable to the public, they've lied about what people do (pretending they've attacked them), they've lied about their use of force, and attacked people in tents to displace them. So a normal police force then? This is a natural reaction when property crime goes unenforced by the government. I know this will be an unpopular take but property crime like shoplifting is not a "victimless" crime agains…

[flagged]

[deleted]
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