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How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

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Re: How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

#21

Post by jeroenhd »

mihaaly wrote: post #3

I am still looking forward for the option to ungroup task bar buttons, preferably with titles. Again! Something that was there before, worked, and was useful. But some designer decided we don't need that, to the bin with it!

Microsoft seemed intent on removing settings and features that only a small segment of their telemetry showed enabled, probably because of some code cleanup efforts. This is despite their earlier attempt to convince everyone to use the weird 3D image editor instead of MS Paint.

A real shame, because they showed with Windows 7 that they can redesign the OS UI without giving up features from earlier versions if they want to. Bugs like "the task bar is 20 pixels taller on my second screen" wouldn't have come up if they'd stuck to restyling their old code base.

I find Microsoft's modern designs very comparable to the GNOME designs, in that they're eager to remove common features to build an overarching operating system theme. I like GNOME's design, much more than Windows 11's, but I don't think taking directions from a heavily criticised DE is the right move.

Re: How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

#22

Post by mihaaly »

Closi wrote: post #6

There is a real cost to consistency/change, and I don't personally believe that this is just laziness or poor design on Microsoft's behalf. Sure, Windows could have changed the look and layout of every component with every release, but with an application as widely used as Windows you really want the ability for users to move from Windows XP to Windows 11 and still have a sense of familiarity and confidence. It is al…

With those 8 or so (partial!) redesigns I do not feel the overwhelming urge for consistency here.

(in fact they broke this and that along the road, the latest and most crucial for me is the taskbar, and I am not talking about the alignemnt, not at all, but all the other possibilities gone, starting with the option of grouping/ungrouping, but not ending there)

Re: How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

#23

Post by oblak »

cokeandpepsi wrote: post #10
mihaaly wrote: post #3

I am still looking forward for the option to ungroup task bar buttons, preferably with titles. Again! Something that was there before, worked, and was useful. But some designer decided we don't need that, to the bin with it!

I'm not sure why they rushed out the release, Windows 10 was and is fine and I don't think any customers were really interested in this new version/ui update/whatever total blunder imo but I think most people are just happy it's not as screwed up as whatever the hell Windows8 was for me personally besides the common complaints just getting to the weather widget is now a huge microannoyance that drives me up the wall

I am still baffled by the whole Windows 8 drama. All they did was they replaced a menu with another one. Everything else was the same or better. Supposed power users freaking out about something completely inconsequential. What the hell is wrong with people

Re: How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

#26

Post by daemin »

vasqw wrote: post #20
eCa wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the first things I installed recently on my first Win11 computer was StartAllBack[1]. It’s not perfect but the standard taskbar is so bad that I had to fix it somehow. [1] https://www.startallback.com/

Costs money.

So does Windows itself.

If you're afraid to or don't want to pay for software then you should probably use some variant of GNU/Linux instead.

Re: How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

#27

Post by alganet »

mihaaly wrote: post #3

I am still looking forward for the option to ungroup task bar buttons, preferably with titles. Again! Something that was there before, worked, and was useful. But some designer decided we don't need that, to the bin with it!

If you're willing to tweak your installation, you can revert to the Windows 10 taskbar using the free third-party ExplorerPatcher utility. It has an option to not combine taskbar items and a lot of other goodies.

Re: How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

#28

Post by mihaaly »

muststopmyths wrote: post #17

As a 25+ year user of windows none of this stuff bothers me. What ticks me off is just the abysmal quality of windows 11 compared to the past. It’s like no one working on it has any pride in their job Example: - hate the new notification area. The action center was so much better - dumb stuff like a window update notification that shows a c# class name instead of windows update - clicking said notification does not b…

I am getting very repetitive here but my first addition to your good list is the taskbar. (and not the center alignment as default - mimicking macOS -, not at all, that's marginal and still can be reverted).

Re: How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

#29

Post by jeroenhd »

simion314 wrote: post #15

I would prefer for feature to exist and work and don't care if the buttons look the same. I am super salty because I tried to run some old 32 bits qt4 and gtk2 python apps on latest Kubuntu LTS (I am 100% only Linux for years )and I just wasted hours without any satisfaction, at least on Windows 10 year old programs will still work most of the time(probably some old games could fail but might be a driver issue and no…

What problems did you run into?

If it's dependencies and packages no longer being shipped, you'll have the same issues running those Python programs on Windows and probably the same solutions as well (downloading all the old sources, compiling all the libraries manually).

You can still run the x86 ABI on x64 (or any other architecture through qemu) though unlike Windows, most Linux distros don't ship support for it by default.

The programs themselves work, but the dependencies have moved on. This is why many recent ecosystems are focusing on static compilation, only demanding a very basic minimal set of functionality (C runtimes and such) from the OS at the cost of needing to patch every single binary on your system one by one when the next log4j/heartbleed bug hits.

This stuff is also why I dislike Python as a platform for running GUI applications. It's easy and it works assuming you put in the work to maintain compatibility yourself. Compiled binaries will work for much longer.

Re: How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

#30

Post by alentred »

To be fair, I think some examples, and specifically those from 95/NT and then 3.1 times, are too far-fetched. I agree that consistency is important, but it doesn't mean that every screen needs to be redesigned altogether. For instance, I don't think that examples of Screen Saver Settings or File Properties are relevant, as long as their styling is in line with the rest of the OS.

One thing that surprises me a lot, though, is that a lot of applications seem to need to be upgraded one-by-one, even if the UI is largely the same and only the styling needs to be upgraded. I never developed for Windows UI, but does it mean that there is no single reusable UI Kit, where just the styling could be changed from OS version to another? Do all these examples demonstrate that different applications are compiled with different UI Frameworks that are all in use and supported?

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