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AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

fortressofdoors.com

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Re: AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

#251

Post by ShredKazoo »

Jiro wrote: post #190
ShredKazoo wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>People will vote it down after they get taken in by the scam, which is too late. Not too late to create training data by which the social media platform can detect and remove subsequent scams. Especially if they 'report' rather than downvote. >A million AIs that are indistinguishable from humans but occasionally throw in a comment about how they got sick from Pepsi could make things very profitable for the Coca-Cola…

>Not too late to create training data by which the social media platform can detect and remove subsequent scams. How is that going to happen? We're assuming the AI posts exactly like a human until the comment about Pepsi comes out. It'll be impossible to distinguish from a human, by assumption. Or are you going to just have the site reject everything which mentions Pepsi negatively? >How is this different from Coca-C…

>How is that going to happen? We're assuming the AI posts exactly like a human until the comment about Pepsi comes out. It'll be impossible to distinguish from a human, by assumption. Or are you going to just have the site reject everything which mentions Pepsi negatively?

You could have a reporting system.

>AIs don't need to be paid.

At scale, this sort of service is not going to be free. But I suppose AI could make it a lot cheaper.

Re: AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

#252

Post by BeFlatXIII »

woeirua wrote: post #9

This article gets it. ChatGPT heralds the end of free user comments, forums and social media. Because when everything and everyone online is fake, why even log on to Insta or FB or Twitter? The internet will still be useful, but Web 2.0 will go the way of the dodo unless it adapts and the easiest way to cut down on spam is to charge users money for access. Spam campaigns are a lot less lucrative when it costs money t…

> the easiest way to cut down on spam is to charge users money for access

Which realistically means everyone will log off and touch grass instead of pay to interact with other verified humans.

Re: AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

#253

Post by Arainach »

pavel_lishin wrote: post #194
shaftoe wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't you mean Fall: Dodge in Hell?

I don't remember if Fall also talked about this; I only read it once, and don't remember too many details. But Anathem definitely did; here's an HN comment quoting it: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14554765

The first act of Fall explicitly takes place in a world polarized into micro-groups because AI chatbots generate so much content that it's impossible to determine what's true. It might even talk about the initial act that started the practice, I forget.

Re: AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

#254

Post by HDThoreaun »

treis wrote: post #183
awestroke wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, people start signing their AI-generated messages. What have we gained?

You can ban them and they'll stay banned. Today they'll come back or switch to one of the other dozen accounts they post crap on. The counter argument to that is that places like Facebook are mostly not pseudonymous and a lot of crap is posted there.

AI generated content will likely be higher quality than what we have today. AI accounts will spend time building reputation with superior content and then burn some on an ad or spam campaign, but they’ll still have a better reputation than most people.

Re: AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

#255

Post by johnny22 »

Geee wrote: post #169
LeftCorner wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The purpose of communication is to distribute and filter information. And connect with other people, feel catharsis, to feel less alone, loved, engaged, interested, and the other things that make us human. AI will not give us that and in fact undermine that. Perhaps then AI will push back to the "real world" for these interactions, as the article opines.

There's more time to connect and have fun with people in the real world when less time is spent on reading & writing comments on the Internet.

unless nobody nearby in the real world shares your interests. That's the reason i got into the internet in the first place!

Re: AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

#256

Post by Firmwarrior »

yunwal wrote: post #239
Firmwarrior wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Half of the Reddit front page is this already. Dudes are swimming in millions of upvotes while blatantly advertising

But you can tell that it's happening. And also it's still only half, and not the entire internet, because human marketers don't scale as much as AI.

I can tell that it's happening because I'm a paranoid fucking psycho. That's not true of the millions and millions of regular human beings using Reddit and Facebook every day

Re: AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

#257

Post by HDThoreaun »

Ensorceled wrote: post #140
seydor wrote: post #23

The internet is not limited to Social networks. The "Market for lemons" has existed for decade, google is a market for lemons where people buy from SEO spam, Google assistant , Siri , amazon are also. The logging off is a pipe dream for some people, even though they know that humans are informational creatures and that the "offline world" has never lived up to the desirable one since the time books were invented. Doo…

> Doominess and gloominess is the real disease of our times I see SIGNIFICANTLY more homeless people in the two cities I frequent than at any other time in my life, there is a snow covered tent city half a kilometer from the glass monstrosity Google has built here and mostly doesn't occupy. Facism is on the rise globally. A third world war is possibly percolating in Europe. Google is soaking up all the bulk of revenu…

Things are undeniably better than they ever were before, especially for those outside the US and Western Europe. We need to work to continue to improve them, but we are in no way going the wrong direction outside of a few small areas such as housing access as you point out.

Re: AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

#258

Post by Faark »

LarryMullins wrote: post #245
pessimizer wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're just poisoning the well. edit: I find it very bizarre and very fashionable to defend the integrity of a verification service that does not exist, and to already dismiss the non-existent people who could suspect that this hypothetical system of verification was corrupt as conspiracy theorists.

Your response is very strange. I have not "defended the integrity of a verification system", nor am I inclined to because I do not support the creation of such verification systems in the first place. And I have no clue what "well" you think I'm poisoning. My point was not that such verification systems are incorruptible. My point is that such verification systems are pointless because they will inevitably be perceiv…

Sure, people will complain. But at the end of the day, you platform either has it or will actually be drowned out by bots. Just like everyone is complaining about moderators, but all the "free speech" have them anyway. Bots doing their part to split society & boosting echo chambers sounds reasonable, but i doubt verification system will have much impact.

Re: AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

#259

Post by Faark »

pessimizer wrote: post #233
bilbo0s wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You guys are misunderstanding how things are developing here. The danger is not that you'll lose anonymity. The danger is that if you use anonymity, no one will listen to you. I'd wager a lot of algorithms will just shadow ban you. This is because you become viewed, effectively, the same way as the AI agent generating brand placement tweets for Bob's Bargain Basement Bar-B-Que and Bitcoin. No one will know the differ…

> Only the verifiable humans will end up with opinions that anyone pays any attention to. This depends on people valuing who is saying something rather than what is being said. I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'm saying that if we're just trading in celebrity rather than ideas that I'm pretty sure we can also create celebrity AIs people would listen to.

Yeah, we will simply use an AI to summarize the article and comment section for us and skip all the spam and crap.

Jokes aside, now that i think about it, "article summaries" are kind common on reddit, but i've never seen such an algorithm used for comments, yet. Guess Up&Down-votes are still the best we have.

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