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Existing smartphones will connect with new satellite constellations in 2023

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Re: Existing smartphones will connect with new satellite constellations in 2023

#71

Post by jrexilius »

MonkeyClub wrote: post #29
bagels wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it hard to believe that there aren't already intelligence satellites up there listening to as much RF as possible everywhere all the time.

There are, but I think the idea here is “the more the merrier”.

I wouldn't go that far. Rather I'd say that it opens up the risks and abuses to a much wider audience. I think the fact that there is no open source baseband firmware or open hardware for the GSM/LTE stack makes it even worse. There is no escape valve for consumers to exercise control over their privacy, and the technology doesn't care about regulatory boundaries, not that _any_ countries government actually wants that.

Re: Existing smartphones will connect with new satellite constellations in 2023

#72

Post by patentatt »

shasheene wrote: post #3

SpaceX and T-Mobile are starting a trial in late-2023 to use unmodified handsets for text (and later, voice and data) with the Starlink V2 network to remove cell coverage dead-zones. [1] [2] It's achieved by "dedicating a slice of T-Mobile's Mid-Band PCS [1.9 GHz] spectrum, to be integrated into Starlink satellites, launched next year", with each Starlink V2 satellite hosting two 5-6 meter long cell-spectrum antennas…

Does anyone know what codec they're using at 2kbps per voice call?

Re: Existing smartphones will connect with new satellite constellations in 2023

#73

Post by billh »

walrus01 wrote: post #48
bagels wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it hard to believe that there aren't already intelligence satellites up there listening to as much RF as possible everywhere all the time.

There literally are, there's very good declassified evidence that has leaked out periodically in small pieces since the mid 1980s that some of what the NSA has are very large satellites with big unfolding umbrella-like antennas aimed directly down at the ground. For SIGINT collection and analysis. Or possibly some combination overlap between the black budget parts of the NRO and NSA. Same size satellite bus as the la…

Trevor Paglen has a pretty amazing talk that discusses finding and photographing some of these satellites. I've linked the specific part of the talk where he starts getting into this, but the entire thing is well worth a watch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lvEMSRKniWk&t=1480s

Re: Existing smartphones will connect with new satellite constellations in 2023

#74

Post by pests »

bee_rider wrote: post #50
pests wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple's solution is making use of special features in the radio package. The post states unmodified phones.

Still, the fact that Apple has figured out the weird RF voodoo already makes it seem like a less ridiculous proposition.

Qualcomm is the one who has figured out the weird RF voodoo you speak of. Apple is just consuming that.

Re: Existing smartphones will connect with new satellite constellations in 2023

#75

Post by woodruffw »

patentatt wrote: post #72
shasheene wrote: post #3

SpaceX and T-Mobile are starting a trial in late-2023 to use unmodified handsets for text (and later, voice and data) with the Starlink V2 network to remove cell coverage dead-zones. [1] [2] It's achieved by "dedicating a slice of T-Mobile's Mid-Band PCS [1.9 GHz] spectrum, to be integrated into Starlink satellites, launched next year", with each Starlink V2 satellite hosting two 5-6 meter long cell-spectrum antennas…

Does anyone know what codec they're using at 2kbps per voice call?

AMR_SID claims to be 1.8kbps[1], but I can't imagine it sounds very good.

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adaptive_Multi-Rate_audio_code...

Re: Existing smartphones will connect with new satellite constellations in 2023

#76

Post by quirino »

cldellow wrote: post #68
quirino wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe you're not aware how much cheaper data is in other countries. Here in Brazil, unlimited Whatsapp + Voice + 5Gb costs 8$/month. Surely there are many factors to this but those Canadian prices still sound insane to me. This website ( https://www.cable.co.uk/mobiles/worldwide-data-pricing/#pric... ) lists Canada as having 50x more expensive data than Italy for instance.

Man, as a Canadian, I hate being put in the position of defending our wireless monopolies. But here goes. That website seems... not great? I think you got a 50x ratio by dividing the average prices of $0.12 (Italy) and $5.94 (Canada). That appears to be a median...but I'd like to know how they chose the plans they used for the calculation. For example, Canada's maximum price is given as $46.02/GB. Perhaps such a plan…

Fair enough, I reckoned the methodology on the website probably wasn't the best, and $/GB is a pretty bad metric to begin with.

I meant it mostly as an example of how there can be an order of magnitude of difference between prices, or at least half an order. I do concede my 50x number is probably very inaccurate in practice.

My family's plan is 80$/month for unlimited data for 6 devices, throttled after something like 60GB between all of them. Unused data can be used on the next month. Not once have I worried about reaching any limits, even with frequent Netflix and YouTube on the go and panic downloading Spotify albums before getting on a flight.

Re: Existing smartphones will connect with new satellite constellations in 2023

#77

Post by pontilanda »

martyvis wrote: post #66
dmitrygr wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, so far they only promised to. So, probably it’ll be done the same way that Teslas could self drive, across the county, unassisted in 2017

It's strange that you think that this is so unachievable yet we have things like Bluetooth, WiFi, LoRa and regular cell phone all working with relatively tiny amounts of power and discriminating from the noise generated by other nonparticipants. This would amaze anyone from before the 70s.

What? My wifi barely reaches the other side of my room with a wall in between, how am I supposed to think 350 miles is within reason? Even with clear sky, your signal to a tower an order of magnitude closer would be unusable.

If you look at apple’s latest feature, even them, with specific hardware probably, requires minutes of open-sky pointing directly at the closest satellite, to transmit mere bytes of data.

That tells me that if your phone is just hanging in your pocket, indoors, with a 5G nearby, it’s not going to reach the satellite at in any shape or form.

Re: Existing smartphones will connect with new satellite constellations in 2023

#78

Post by kylec »

shasheene wrote: post #3

SpaceX and T-Mobile are starting a trial in late-2023 to use unmodified handsets for text (and later, voice and data) with the Starlink V2 network to remove cell coverage dead-zones. [1] [2] It's achieved by "dedicating a slice of T-Mobile's Mid-Band PCS [1.9 GHz] spectrum, to be integrated into Starlink satellites, launched next year", with each Starlink V2 satellite hosting two 5-6 meter long cell-spectrum antennas…

[flagged]

Re: Existing smartphones will connect with new satellite constellations in 2023

#79

Post by nbar »

walrus01 wrote: post #48
bagels wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it hard to believe that there aren't already intelligence satellites up there listening to as much RF as possible everywhere all the time.

There literally are, there's very good declassified evidence that has leaked out periodically in small pieces since the mid 1980s that some of what the NSA has are very large satellites with big unfolding umbrella-like antennas aimed directly down at the ground. For SIGINT collection and analysis. Or possibly some combination overlap between the black budget parts of the NRO and NSA. Same size satellite bus as the la…

Yes; the misty program is what you are thinking of. It had a clamshell RF shield to deflect incoming tracking

Re: Existing smartphones will connect with new satellite constellations in 2023

#80

Post by zerohp »

m00dy wrote: post #69

Usually, these satellites fly over 500km altitude, and as far as I know, none of the nation-states can take them down due to the limited rocket science capacity.

The U.S. successfully shot down a satellite at that altitude in 1985 with an F-15 and a specially designed missile. Are they all 35 years behind? I don't think that's a good assumption.
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