Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Tesla stock falls again, toward longest losing streak in more than 4 years

marketwatch.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

251–260 of 387 posts

Re: Tesla stock falls again, toward longest losing streak in more than 4 years

#251

Post by dragonwriter »

jacquesm wrote: post #220
dragonwriter wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What I find interesting is nobody complained about Musk’s social media antics when he proclaimed himself to be Technoking of Tesla or when he hyped dogecoins with diamond hands. People have indeed criticized both of those and many of the other things Musk has tweeted before the recent Tesla stock decline, and even the SEC has taken legal action based on ]Musk’s past tweets.

Not enough to discourage him from doing it some more.

“People didn't complain beefore the recent stock decline”

and

“Musk didn't change his behavior in response to complaints (except, perhaps, to lean into the behavior complained about even harder)”

are fundamentally different claims.

Re: Tesla stock falls again, toward longest losing streak in more than 4 years

#252

Post by kortilla »

jacquesm wrote: post #135
leereeves wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The NASDAQ exchange was closed yesterday. Edit: including the after-hours market, according to https://www.nasdaq.com/market-activity/stocks/tsla/after-hou... > Data last updated Dec 23, 2022 08:00 PM ET. > This page will resume updating on Dec 27, 2022 04:00 PM ET. (Elon's second tweet was before the pre-market opened.)

Are you familiar with the term 'pre-market' sales? Tesla opened a full $6 lower than the last close because of the pre-market sentiment, and in part this was due to the tweet. How big a fraction is impossible to say but I'm pretty sure that Musk is well aware of the effect of his tweets by now. I don't have access to a terminal but I can look back as far as 4 am on public sources and by then it was clear the stock wa…

> monitoring Tesla's stock price like a hawk and if the sentiment drops he'll be aware of it well before the figures are published.

This is not a thing. The figures come out in real time for very basic trading accounts and iirc google finance gives them real time from the exchanges.

Also, the opening price is not set by pre-market action unless there a massive amount of abnormal AH volume. The participants that show up for the opening bids are 3-4 orders of magnitude higher in volume than the pre-market traders. Gauging general market sentiment from after hours action is folly, even in highly traded instruments like the index futures or the SPY etf.

Re: Tesla stock falls again, toward longest losing streak in more than 4 years

#253

Post by lamontcg »

antasvara wrote: post #181
asfgionio2346 wrote: post #52

I find myself confused about the purpose of stock markets. How can we arrange our society around a system that is so massively irrational? A few years ago Tesla was worth as much as the rest of the car industry put together . Even if you believed Tesla was going to become a perfect monopoly, its valuation still would not have been justified. Now people are acting like the sky is falling when this pipsqueak manufactur…

Tesla isn't only a car company. They also have a lot of technology related to clean energy, along with the self driving technology they are creating. The bull case isn't "Tesla becomes a monopoly in automobiles." The bull case is "Tesla becomes a car monopoly, monopolizes self driving, creates a great semi truck, has solar panels on half of the buildings in the US, and supplies battery technology to every clean energ…

Yeah the bull case would be something close to considering TSLA to be AMZN in 2006 or so launching AWS and taking advantage of first-mover advantage in the cloud space--only with clean energy and FSD.

If you believed that was a likely outcome then the insane valuations would seem not so insane, which is why it got bet up to those levels.

Re: Tesla stock falls again, toward longest losing streak in more than 4 years

#254

Post by jacquesm »

dragonwriter wrote: post #251
jacquesm wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not enough to discourage him from doing it some more.

“People didn't complain beefore the recent stock decline” and “Musk didn't change his behavior in response to complaints (except, perhaps, to lean into the behavior complained about even harder)” are fundamentally different claims.

But people did complain. And Musk did not change his behavior. And I suspect that as long as he isn't smacked down really hard he won't change it in the future either.

Re: Tesla stock falls again, toward longest losing streak in more than 4 years

#255

Post by kortilla »

asfgionio2346 wrote: post #52

I find myself confused about the purpose of stock markets. How can we arrange our society around a system that is so massively irrational? A few years ago Tesla was worth as much as the rest of the car industry put together . Even if you believed Tesla was going to become a perfect monopoly, its valuation still would not have been justified. Now people are acting like the sky is falling when this pipsqueak manufactur…

> A few years ago Tesla was worth as much as the rest of the car industry put together. Even if you believed Tesla was going to become a perfect monopoly, its valuation still would not have been justified.

The bet is on Tesla doing more than regular cars. How much does the calculus change when people think it will eat the taxi/rideshare market, the solar market, the backup battery market, the charger market, and potentially robotics?

Tesla’s valuation is entirely based on investing in that vision. That’s why it’s notable that it’s precipitously collapsing. People are losing faith and it might just become a regular old car company.

> We knew the value of the stock to the penny starting in April of last year, but for months it traded at over a 25% discount

No you didn’t. You knew the closing price of an offer that the buyer was trying to back out of.

Re: Tesla stock falls again, toward longest losing streak in more than 4 years

#256

Post by P5fRxh5kUvp2th »

dkjaudyeqooe wrote: post #79
kylecordes wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It appeared to many observers that Musk was mocking the Russian propaganda, he then made the mockery explicit later. I don't understand the thesis that Musk is somehow pro-Russia. Generally his ventures are against Russia interests: SpaceX, launched in the aftermath of Russia being uninterested in selling a leftover rocket to Musk, now dominates the launch industry to the detriment of Russia, among other things halti…

How does Musk posting that sort of stuff, which is difficult to get across in text at the best of times, benefit anyone, including Musk? It's a pattern of pointless provocative nonsense by Musk, befitting a teenager, not the CEO of multiple multi-billion dollar companies. I guess he's free to do what he wants, but people are free to read whatever they want into it as well. Dismissing it as humour is not a given.

I've never been on twitter and _will_ never be on twitter because I have zero interest in 140 character posts (now 280).

OTOH, I get the feeling people are being overly judgemental due to text being hard and 280 character text being even harder.

Re: Tesla stock falls again, toward longest losing streak in more than 4 years

#257

Post by P5fRxh5kUvp2th »

coolbreezetft22 wrote: post #106
scifibestfi wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For a time it was considered propaganda to push for peace. It was truly bizarro. Then a few weeks later regime approved voices said we should consider peace and it was no longer considered propaganda.

He pushed for Ukrainian territory to be formally ceded to Russia after they occupied it by force and violence. His "peace plan" was then enthusiastically praised by Kremlin propaganda. It seems his push for peace is always one sided in that all his ridiculous plans end with Russia being rewarded for aggression and Ukraine losing territory.

I'll note that a request for examples was made several posts back and no one seems willing to post them, only describe their interpretation of them.

Re: Tesla stock falls again, toward longest losing streak in more than 4 years

#258

Post by zzleeper »

I kinda hate that I'm "forced" to buy stupid TSLA stock just because, as a responsible adult, I put most of my investments in the SP500, and any alternative I could find that excludes firms I hate (FB, TSLA) has infinitely higher expense ratios :/

Re: Tesla stock falls again, toward longest losing streak in more than 4 years

#259

Post by kortilla »

CharlesW wrote: post #6

From https://twitter.com/BriannaWu/status/1607719007892738050 , written while Tesla was at $123.15: While the markets have been closed, two major stories about Tesla have broken. A. Tesla is shutting down factories because demand is plummeting. B. Musk praised a truly insane Russian propaganda tweet, predicting the fall of the west She expects Tesla to fall below $100 by 1/1. It seems notable that the price of used T…

Quoting Brianna Wu for anything related to Tesla or Musk is like quoting Fox News for Biden insights.

Re: Tesla stock falls again, toward longest losing streak in more than 4 years

#260

Post by P5fRxh5kUvp2th »

barnacled wrote: post #121
kylecordes wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It appeared to many observers that Musk was mocking the Russian propaganda, he then made the mockery explicit later. I don't understand the thesis that Musk is somehow pro-Russia. Generally his ventures are against Russia interests: SpaceX, launched in the aftermath of Russia being uninterested in selling a leftover rocket to Musk, now dominates the launch industry to the detriment of Russia, among other things halti…

[flagged]

> At the very least making 'ambiguous' comments as he has done in the past AND WHICH HAS BEEN USED IN RUSSIAN PROPAGANDA is the absolute HEIGHT of irresponsibility.

He's a dude posting on twitter, he has no responsibility for anything.

Post reply on HN