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Ask HN: Is there a better model than flagging?

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Re: Ask HN: Is there a better model than flagging?

#31

Post by mactavish88 »

theCrowing wrote: post #27
mactavish88 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get none of those links on the first page. It took several pages of search results before I started seeing any of the links you’ve shared here.

Now you are just lying... DuckDuckGo doesn't profile its users according to their search patterns, and everyone gets the same search results. [1] [1] https://spreadprivacy.com/google-filter-bubble-study/ EDIT: Yeah, maybe he wasn't lying but the standard search results from 5 different VPN locations with different browsers and user agents is linked below. still sus.

Here you go, my first page of hits on mobile: https://imgur.com/a/zSL5fVX

Only when I got to my laptop now did the set of links differ: https://imgur.com/a/EuUt7U5

Clearly not the same set of results for the same search.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a better model than flagging?

#32

Post by mactavish88 »

theCrowing wrote: post #30
mactavish88 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But also, if there was at least a reason tagged along with the flagging, that could be helpful to submitters, don’t you think? Making people guess as to the reason for flagging seems like poor UX to me, and increases the overall hostility of the site to users. Also, those links I posted are of far less importance to me than my actual concern in terms of how HN and other sites shape my perception of the world based on…

As a member of a community or site, it is important to take the time to familiarize yourself with the guidelines and frequently asked questions in order to understand how it operates. There are numerous threads available discussing user-driven moderation on this platform, some even addressing the same concerns you have raised. It seems that you have not made an effort to understand the rules and features of the site,…

As per my comment on your other thread:

> Here you go, my first page of hits on mobile: https://imgur.com/a/zSL5fVX

> Only when I got to my laptop now did the set of links differ: https://imgur.com/a/EuUt7U5

> Clearly not the same set of results for the same search.

Re: this site's guidelines, I find your comment here a little disingenuous and far too generous towards HN's "guidelines". The mere fact that such content as this exists suggests that HN's guidelines are quite opaque: https://github.com/minimaxir/hacker-news-undocumented

Re: Ask HN: Is there a better model than flagging?

#33

Post by theCrowing »

mactavish88 wrote: post #31
theCrowing wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now you are just lying... DuckDuckGo doesn't profile its users according to their search patterns, and everyone gets the same search results. [1] [1] https://spreadprivacy.com/google-filter-bubble-study/ EDIT: Yeah, maybe he wasn't lying but the standard search results from 5 different VPN locations with different browsers and user agents is linked below. still sus.

Here you go, my first page of hits on mobile: https://imgur.com/a/zSL5fVX Only when I got to my laptop now did the set of links differ: https://imgur.com/a/EuUt7U5 Clearly not the same set of results for the same search.

See that's another you problem you changed something and now your search results are distorted. Here are screenshots from 5 different VPN locations with different browsers and different user agents... https://imgur.com/a/P4zoAzf

Re: Ask HN: Is there a better model than flagging?

#34

Post by theCrowing »

mactavish88 wrote: post #32
theCrowing wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a member of a community or site, it is important to take the time to familiarize yourself with the guidelines and frequently asked questions in order to understand how it operates. There are numerous threads available discussing user-driven moderation on this platform, some even addressing the same concerns you have raised. It seems that you have not made an effort to understand the rules and features of the site,…

As per my comment on your other thread: > Here you go, my first page of hits on mobile: https://imgur.com/a/zSL5fVX > Only when I got to my laptop now did the set of links differ: https://imgur.com/a/EuUt7U5 > Clearly not the same set of results for the same search. Re: this site's guidelines, I find your comment here a little disingenuous and far too generous towards HN's "guidelines". The mere fact that such conten…

It appears that you may have misunderstood the distinction between guidelines and their enforcement. While the guidelines themselves are public, the methods of enforcement are not made publicly available in order to prevent individuals from attempting to circumvent them.

> See that's another you problem you changed something and now your search results are distorted. Here are screenshots from 5 different VPN locations with different browsers and different user agents... https://imgur.com/a/P4zoAzf

Re: Ask HN: Is there a better model than flagging?

#35

Post by whythre »

theCrowing wrote: post #13
mactavish88 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So this is exactly the perspective I’m looking for from HN. If my post (which clearly wasn’t for or against the linked material) was not immediately flagged and killed then it would’ve been possible to actually solicit this kind of perspective. But if my post is immediately killed then I never get to see this kind of insight. Hence my question about whether there’s a better model than simply flagging content, as HN c…

[flagged]

I am trying not to read this with hostile intent, but seriously, why discuss or ask anything if the OP could just be told to do the mental legwork themselves? Sometimes outside perspective is helpful.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a better model than flagging?

#36

Post by theCrowing »

whythre wrote: post #35
theCrowing wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I am trying not to read this with hostile intent, but seriously, why discuss or ask anything if the OP could just be told to do the mental legwork themselves? Sometimes outside perspective is helpful.

I perceive the lack of basic research or education on a subject as a sign of hostile intent especially when an individual creates a thread and expresses their views vehemently without proper knowledge or understanding. It's not even a topic (HN moderation) that is hard to research, he just didn't. It's also a repeating pattern he did the same with his initial submission and afterwards with this thread. 1-2 hours after he submitted the thread, he pivoted to his UX argument which makes even less sense because that's fundamentally his problem he needs to understand the site he is on, and he didn't even know about the "showdead" switch in the profile view. Which means in close to 4 years he didn't read the FAQ. How can you advocate for change if you don't even understand the system that is in place and without doing even the most basic research yourself?

Re: Ask HN: Is there a better model than flagging?

#37

Post by jacquesm »

mactavish88 wrote: post #23
theCrowing wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's your problem. If you see your content flagged immediately your first course of action is complaining about it? Why not do the rational thing and google it so you can understand why other people flag it. As I said it's not my job to make you comprehend that the content you submitted is subpar quality. It's yours.

Maybe just move on with your life and don’t engage with the content if you’re not interested?

They do exactly what you want: engage with you, even though you seem to have already made up your mind about the desired outcome (which you aren't going to get). And then you tell them to move on with their life? That's pretty rude.

To me this whole thread looks like a way to social engineer your way around getting your articles flagged in spite of that being the most democratic mechanism to keep HN on track.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a better model than flagging?

#38

Post by logicalmonster »

theCrowing wrote: post #4
mactavish88 wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does that help if the post’s not alive for long enough for more than a handful of people to see it?

The headline of the site and your submission is also just plain wrong. Maybe there is no manmade climate emergency but there is most certainly a climate emergency. Also there is nothing scientific on the site only an open letter... it's just really bad content. You don't know how many people have seen or voted on it you are just believing that nobody has seen it. Multiple users need to flag your post before it become…

> there is most certainly a climate emergency

For what it's worth, I'd most strongly disagree with your use of the phrase "there is most certainly" there. There's nothing objective in science that declares what an "emergency" is. Deciding whether or not any situation is an emergency can never be the result of any science experiment.

IMO, most disagreements about "science" that crop up about contentious topics aren't really science disagreements, they're subjective risk-management disagreements.

Two people can look at the objective statistics about a situation and one person might see it as an emergency and one might not. They're technically both right because this is subjective in nature.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a better model than flagging?

#40

Post by theCrowing »

logicalmonster wrote: post #38
theCrowing wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The headline of the site and your submission is also just plain wrong. Maybe there is no manmade climate emergency but there is most certainly a climate emergency. Also there is nothing scientific on the site only an open letter... it's just really bad content. You don't know how many people have seen or voted on it you are just believing that nobody has seen it. Multiple users need to flag your post before it become…

> there is most certainly a climate emergency For what it's worth, I'd most strongly disagree with your use of the phrase "there is most certainly" there. There's nothing objective in science that declares what an "emergency" is. Deciding whether or not any situation is an emergency can never be the result of any science experiment. IMO, most disagreements about "science" that crop up about contentious topics aren't…

I utilized the term in reference to the flagged submission for the sake of simplicity and ease of comprehension for the individual in question. The term 'emergency' carries connotations and should be used with caution when describing any situation.
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