How this relates to WebSub (previously known as PubSubHubbub)? https://www.w3.org/TR/websub/
rssCloud is a separate protocol, but performs many of the same functions as WebSub.
RssCloud, WordPress. FeedLand, and Dave Winer
31–40 of 40 posts
Re: RssCloud, WordPress. FeedLand, and Dave Winer
#32How this relates to WebSub (previously known as PubSubHubbub)? https://www.w3.org/TR/websub/
As far as I am aware WebSub has more or less completely obsoleted RssCloud. Source: I run a feed reader service that supports WebSub and when I checked none of our subscriptions support RssCloud but not WebSub.
I would be interested in know what your feed reader service is, and how subscriptions support WebSub.
Re: RssCloud, WordPress. FeedLand, and Dave Winer
#33why seems everybody to ignore Atom (RFC4287)? Is it to follow iTunes' innovation leadership in doing so? I'd be curious.
Atom feeds can also support rssCloud through the addition of a cloud element as defined in the RSS spec.
Re: RssCloud, WordPress. FeedLand, and Dave Winer
#34My summary of the recent work in the rssCloud arena
What is rssCloud exactly and why should a long-time blogger care about it? I ask this not to be facetious. It's because I read your blog post with interest, but by the end, I still wasn't sure. Your second paragraph, which defines rssCloud, gave a kind of technical description (the "what") but not the user benefit description (the "why"). Unfortunately I found the Wikipedia article to be much the same. Basically, I c…
The main benefit of rssCloud is quicker notification of updates versus polling every 10 to 60 minutes, as most feed readers do. The drawbacks are that the tool generating the RSS feed needs to include another element (the cloud element), the tool needs to inform a server that an update has occurred (need a server), and there has to be an app that registers with the server to get updates, and to display those updates (need an app that supports rssCloud). Without all of those 3 pieces, rssCloud is not going to provide the value of quicker notification. You could also consult your fellow employee, Joseph Scott, who worked on the WordPress plugin, for more context.
I am not familiar with what is needed to support WebSub, but I assume there is some work involved, just as there would be for XMPP, Jabber and any other protocol that involves more than polling. That "extra work" is the barrier to entry that helps keep people using Twitter and Facebook - the users get that notification "hit" and network effect without any extra work on their part.
Re: RssCloud, WordPress. FeedLand, and Dave Winer
#35why seems everybody to ignore Atom (RFC4287)? Is it to follow iTunes' innovation leadership in doing so? I'd be curious.
I was intrigued by the title of this article and if I remember well Atom was a sensible standard that was quite well defined, but specifically Dave Winer didn't want it to happen because it was not invented by him. I switched all RSS-y stuff I had to develop + all sites I control to Atom long ago, and it pretty much just works.
See my earlier reply, Atom can support rssCloud through the addition of a cloud element.
Re: RssCloud, WordPress. FeedLand, and Dave Winer
#36Interesting comments about Dave Winer in the article. I first became aware of him in the last year or two via a mention here on HN. Since then, I have been receiving and reading his daily blog post via email. (He claims his blog has been running longer than any other in existence, could be true). They guy is clearly smart and hard working, and has lots of ideas, many of which seem good. What he shares about his perso…
I included the information about Dave Winer in the article because (1) there have been problems in his products regarding rssCloud support for WordPress sites, which I wanted "on the record", and (2) I felt that his attitude toward "help" needs to be called out, otherwise people would not be aware, and have that context in reading his blog/side of the story. He mentions Automattic in his post on December 24th (http://scripting.com/2022/12/24/162940.html#a163527) regarding rssCloud work with WordPress, but it was really Andrew Shell (http://feedland.org/?item=880552) that did the work to make it happen.
Re: RssCloud, WordPress. FeedLand, and Dave Winer
#37Earlier quoted context omitted.
As far as I am aware WebSub has more or less completely obsoleted RssCloud. Source: I run a feed reader service that supports WebSub and when I checked none of our subscriptions support RssCloud but not WebSub.
I would be interested in know what your feed reader service is, and how subscriptions support WebSub.
My feed reader service is https://feedmail.org. The simplest instructions for WebSub are those on the public Google hub https://pubsubhubbub.appspot.com/. But there are other public hubs available or you can run your own.
Re: RssCloud, WordPress. FeedLand, and Dave Winer
#38Earlier quoted context omitted.
What is rssCloud exactly and why should a long-time blogger care about it? I ask this not to be facetious. It's because I read your blog post with interest, but by the end, I still wasn't sure. Your second paragraph, which defines rssCloud, gave a kind of technical description (the "what") but not the user benefit description (the "why"). Unfortunately I found the Wikipedia article to be much the same. Basically, I c…
The main benefit of rssCloud is quicker notification of updates versus polling every 10 to 60 minutes, as most feed readers do. The drawbacks are that the tool generating the RSS feed needs to include another element (the cloud element), the tool needs to inform a server that an update has occurred (need a server), and there has to be an app that registers with the server to get updates, and to display those updates…
Thanks, that makes sense. So the core problem it solves is preventing the need for polling for feed consumers and apps, allowing for real-time notifications of updates. In theory, people could use rssCloud to adapt blogging platforms into microblogging use cases, e.g. using the simplicity of an analogy, Mastodon use cases built atop WordPress infrastructure.
Re: RssCloud, WordPress. FeedLand, and Dave Winer
#39> a user did not have to find a rssCloud server for their feed to reference – their own site could handle feed registrations and notifications to feed reader apps. This created a supply of literally millions of weblogs that could support quick notifications to their readers if their reading app supported the use of rssCloud. Um, is it just me or does that sound like a DDOS waiting to happen? (I'm out of the loop on t…
Can you provide details? I'm not familiar with RssCloud but WebSub requires the notification endpoint to confirm a subscription before sending new entries. So your DoS amplification is one small HTTP request for a small HTTP request. I guess at best it would make it slightly harder to block as it is coming from everywhere.
> Can you provide details?
Sorry, no. I'm not an expert. I'm just pattern matching.
Re: RssCloud, WordPress. FeedLand, and Dave Winer
#40Earlier quoted context omitted.
I was intrigued by the title of this article and if I remember well Atom was a sensible standard that was quite well defined, but specifically Dave Winer didn't want it to happen because it was not invented by him. I switched all RSS-y stuff I had to develop + all sites I control to Atom long ago, and it pretty much just works.
See my earlier reply, Atom can support rssCloud through the addition of a cloud element.
Yes. Note that you are by far not the first person noticing that collaborating with Dave is... challenging.