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Ask HN: Racism in London

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Ask HN: Racism in London

#1
I traveled to London this week and I’ve been going to restaurants. When people see me (I’m black), they always say the restaurant is booked. Finally, after a few minutes I came back and spoke to a black woman who was working there and asked for a seat. She gave me a seat right away. According to her, the restaurant was not booked. There was plenty of space. I don’t know what to make of this. Has someone had a similar experience?

Re: Ask HN: Racism in London

#3
I don't know how to help, but just wanted to say... sorry you had that experience =/ Nobody should. Anywhere, really, but especially in a supposedly metropolitan city like London.

Re: Ask HN: Racism in London

#4

London is a huge diverse city. What area of London are you having trouble? I’m not black, but lived in black communities there. You may have more luck in East or South London areas.

If that's true it is a shameful thing.

Come to Lisbon instead. We're not even that civilised but you certainly won't have trouble being served anywhere.

Re: Ask HN: Racism in London

#6
This is tangential to your question. Mostly because all I can do is sympathize and wish you the best. But I did not care for London. Edinburgh is the friendliest place I've visited in the UK if you have the flexibility to spend your vacation elsewhere.

Re: Ask HN: Racism in London

#7
I had this experience as an Indian there (but also in the US and Canada so not exclusive to London).

In fact, our experience was almost identical in a restaurant in Windsor, and after we were allowed in, we were sat in the worst spot behind a door, not allowed to use a different table and the waiter outright ignored us. A white family came and were given a great table, and attended to. All other tables were empty.

A few things helped:

1. Calling them out on it. If you have the energy and you feel it’s worth it, it’s worth escalating to the manager. Sometimes I’ve met racist managers too but in most cases they apologize, chalk it up to a misunderstanding and give a discount. In the case of the Windsor restaurant the manager told us to leave when we mentioned how badly we were treated , which we reported and were told that they had a history of it. But in other cases it’s worked out well.

2. I hate doing it, but I had to reflect on my own appearance. I had naturally wild curly hair, and a beard. This was neat for my hair type but not by straight hair standards (hair based racism is a big thing). Even though I was well dressed, a lot of people would look at me when I was single and distance themselves or not allow me in. So if I was going some place and I didn’t want to deal with it, I’d straighten my hair and try and find a female friend to go with me. This is also the case at border crossings. I’d get pulled aside for questioning or security checks more often, but when I travel with my wife or female friends, I’d always get passed through. There’s a lot of distrust for what people think are “scruffy, lone men” even if the reality is that they’re comparing to their racist aesthetic senses.

3. Find someone from your demographic or closer to it, like you did at this place. When we moved to the UK as a kid, my mum would do that and it took me a while to understand why. It was because she was initially treated poorly by many of the non-Indian staff and finding an Indian person there helped because they’d understand and help out.

4. Use humour. When I first moved to Canada I was greeted by a lot of racism. People outright refused to shake my hand. I found making jokes about their behaviour towards me , or the situation as a whole, either made them feel foolish or broke the ice enough that they felt momentarily endeared enough to see past their biases.

Dealing with day to day racism as an individual from other individuals is a form of social engineering. I try and understand their headspace and work around it. In most cases these people aren’t actively trying to be racist , but they’re also very unaware about what they’re doing. Those are the ones you can work around. The ones who are actively participating are the ones I move on from because they often get violent.

Re: Ask HN: Racism in London

#8
A bit off-topic, but something unique to India is reverse-racism, if I can call it that. Many a times, me and friends (mostly all male) try to enter a decent restaurant/pub only to be shown away saying its all booked for the evening. We could clearly see that was not the case. Even if stag entry is generally allowed at those places. But they happily welcome foreigners (of all kinds) right after they deny us. We Indians are an amusing bunch!

Re: Ask HN: Racism in London

#10
Probably not race related. Ever since Brexit/Covid restaurants are understaffed. We regularly go in to empty restaurants and get told they’re fully booked. If it’s a chain place, especially, the staff just don’t care enough to “fit you in”.
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