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Hotels turn to robots and room cleanings every 4 days to ease staffing shortages

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Re: Hotels turn to robots and room cleanings every 4 days to ease staffing shortages

#451

Post by tdeck »

typest wrote: post #429

There is a take that consistently comes up in discussions like this (and indeed is prominent several times on this post), which says "the problem isn't a shortage of workers, it's that employers don't want to pay workers enough." This seems somewhat limited to me, and there is an alternate explanation I would like to explore. It seems to me rising cost of labor, while good for the people being paid that rising cost,…

> in 10 years, we all generally stay at hotels where robots vacuum our floors every day, but no one ever makes your bed for you -- that becomes a relic of the past.

There are plenty of people today who can't stay at hotels that make your bed because they can't afford to stay at hotels at all.

By the same token, 100 years ago most people couldn't afford decorative masonry on their homes in NYC. Working class people often lived in crowded, poorly ventilated fire trap tenements that have long since been demolished.

Re: Hotels turn to robots and room cleanings every 4 days to ease staffing shortages

#452

Post by chewz »

typest wrote: post #429

There is a take that consistently comes up in discussions like this (and indeed is prominent several times on this post), which says "the problem isn't a shortage of workers, it's that employers don't want to pay workers enough." This seems somewhat limited to me, and there is an alternate explanation I would like to explore. It seems to me rising cost of labor, while good for the people being paid that rising cost,…

If labour is too cheap there isn't enough incentive to innovate and automate tasks...

And I always wonder why we agree that market price is solution to everything except when it comes to labour...

Re: Hotels turn to robots and room cleanings every 4 days to ease staffing shortages

#453

Post by typest »

cudgy wrote: post #448
typest wrote: post #444

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this makes sense with what I'm saying. Laborers get more of the profits of companies and in turn get wealthier. However, the costs of services in turn go up (due to rising cost of labor), so those laborers (society) cannot actually afford more services (provided by people). Workers can more easily purchase goods which benefit from increasing automation and technology. So, these workers which are capturing mor…

No. I am suggesting that laborers get more of the profits and prices do not rise. Business owners actually get less profit. You keep assuming that business owners can and will just raise prices and the markets will bear it, but this is not always the case.

Let's say there is a masseuse. They use their labor to give massages. They are also self employed, so they own their own business. If the cost of labor rises, the masseuse makes more money from giving massages, but this necessarily means that the price of their massages is going up (the cost of labor and the price of the massage are the same thing). Okay, let's take this one step further.

Let's assume that there is a massage parlor, with masseuses who do not own the business, and that the owner of the business has some profit. Cost of labor goes up, and now the business owner no longer has any profit, and it is earned by the masseuses. Yay! However, what happens if/when cost of labor goes up further, and there is no more profit? Prices will rise.

> You keep assuming that business owners can and will just raise prices and the markets will bear it, but this is not always the case.

I think this is my point actually. Markets won't always bear it. Sometimes they will raise their prices and the markets won't bear it, and then the business will no longer exist, and society won't be able to pay for it. E.g., the business of a hotel that makes everyones beds every day, or the business that builds a beautiful NYC building adorned with hand carved stone across the entire facade.

Re: Hotels turn to robots and room cleanings every 4 days to ease staffing shortages

#454

Post by sokoloff »

CyberDildonics wrote: post #424
sokoloff wrote: post #404

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you might be mis-reading the GP's point. It's not that it's a common occurrence for laptops to spontaneously combust, but rather than an adversary could intentionally cause one (or several) to do so.

And then what? Is someone going to hijack a plane by setting their laptop battery on fire?

Suicide bombers have downed planes before. Bombs have been left in the cabin to go off on the next segment.

It’s not every terrorist's goal to walk away from their event.

Re: Hotels turn to robots and room cleanings every 4 days to ease staffing shortages

#455

Post by cudgy »

typest wrote: post #453
cudgy wrote: post #448

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. I am suggesting that laborers get more of the profits and prices do not rise. Business owners actually get less profit. You keep assuming that business owners can and will just raise prices and the markets will bear it, but this is not always the case.

Let's say there is a masseuse. They use their labor to give massages. They are also self employed, so they own their own business. If the cost of labor rises, the masseuse makes more money from giving massages, but this necessarily means that the price of their massages is going up (the cost of labor and the price of the massage are the same thing). Okay, let's take this one step further. Let's assume that there is a…

> Cost of labor goes up, and now the business owner no longer has any profit, and it is earned by the masseuses.

This assumes the incremental cost of labor has eaten up all the profit, which is rarely the case. When it does happen and increases in prices are not supported, the viability of this business model is suspect. Basically, the market does not value the “middleman” business owner that does nothing more than rent space to a masseuse. Are they really even a masseuse business or are they an office space rental company?

Re: Hotels turn to robots and room cleanings every 4 days to ease staffing shortages

#456

Post by craftkiller »

wenc wrote: post #184
TedDoesntTalk wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another app to install and leak my privacy. No thanks. I’ll wait in line for a key card.

What information will the app have that the hotel wouldn’t have at check in?

You have to provide location access to enable bluetooth which means things like this story of the most unethical thing this former Twitter employee was asked to build are possible: https://twitter.com/stevekrenzel/status/1589700721121058817

Re: Hotels turn to robots and room cleanings every 4 days to ease staffing shortages

#457

Post by gameman144 »

cudgy wrote: post #455
typest wrote: post #453

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's say there is a masseuse. They use their labor to give massages. They are also self employed, so they own their own business. If the cost of labor rises, the masseuse makes more money from giving massages, but this necessarily means that the price of their massages is going up (the cost of labor and the price of the massage are the same thing). Okay, let's take this one step further. Let's assume that there is a…

> Cost of labor goes up, and now the business owner no longer has any profit, and it is earned by the masseuses. This assumes the incremental cost of labor has eaten up all the profit, which is rarely the case. When it does happen and increases in prices are not supported, the viability of this business model is suspect. Basically, the market does not value the “middleman” business owner that does nothing more than r…

> When it does happen and increases in prices are not supported, the viability of this business model is suspect.

I think you and the parent poster are agreeing here. Clearly there are degrees to which profit can be reduced, but if a business isn't growing its own profits at the same time as rising labor costs, then at a certain point the business will be just breaking even. Past that point, there is no alternative besides raising prices or shuttering the business.

This is the OP's point about certain businesses maybe not being viable, but society being worse for it. For instance, maybe hotels in all but the busiest cities aren't supported by the market at higher labor costs. Good in terms of workers not being paid peanuts, but bad for anyone trying to drive across the country (and society as a whole).

Re: Hotels turn to robots and room cleanings every 4 days to ease staffing shortages

#458

Post by robertlagrant »

dahart wrote: post #408
robertlagrant wrote: post #401

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's fair, although I still don't think it's that close. An actually automatic weapon is the sort of thing militaries use, and witout minimising the horror that a bump stock can cause, I think they do far more. Back to my original point, it's still wrong to say this will happen while we have automatic weapons. Why perpetuate a lie?

Several states and the Federal government found bump stock close enough to automatic that they are no longer legal. I’d guess the quote from the article is referring to the same point of view, a thin line from the perspective of the non gun-owning layman.

It's a thin line because of terrible reporting. This is destructive because until we get basic facts clear the pro-gun people are just not going to take people who say such things seriously. No more "assault-style" weapons or "fully semi-automatic" guns. Just tell the truth and break down the semantic defenses.

Re: Hotels turn to robots and room cleanings every 4 days to ease staffing shortages

#459

Post by Scoundreller »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #392
Scoundreller wrote: post #384

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless you do a “mystery” deal, where you can save a ton in exchange for some uncertainty. It’s always worked pretty well for me, tbh.

Those are called opaque rates in the business, but not comparable to being able to reserve a hotel room directly via a website for less than the hotel’s own website.

It does mean when people/hotels say “you’ll get the lowest/best rates direct so don’t use an OTA”, that’s a lie/not exactly true.

They don’t like it when you book through a travel agent, but they really have a love/hate opinion when you book an express/mystery deal

Re: Hotels turn to robots and room cleanings every 4 days to ease staffing shortages

#460

Post by Scoundreller »

phpisthebest wrote: post #423
Scoundreller wrote: post #380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like the words of someone that overpaid for a business/property. Or extracted too much capital when they could instead of paying down debt and got trapped under a rock when interest rates went up.

The hotel or the businesses with the cap? Speaking for my org personally we have zero debt, and are cash positive largely because policies like a hotel expense cap that prevent sales people from draining to company coffers

The hotel, or any other business really.

If I buy a farm/restaurant/hotel/retailer for top dollar and complain about cost of wages making it unprofitable, the problem isn’t the wages. But you’re stuck with your acquisition price, so you’ll lobby for lower wages and make no mention of your sunk costs.

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