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Web IDE Beta

docs.gitlab.com

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Re: Web IDE Beta

#121

Post by bitwize »

FpUser wrote: post #112
screamingninja wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Anyone think there'll be another editor that'll surpass VSCode Worthy mention- Zed is the spiritual successful of Atom that is being rewritten in Rust. Text editors gain and lose popularity often, so the potential is definitely there. https://zed.dev/

Rust - I would not give rat's ass about what language was used to write an IDE as long as it performs adequately. VS Code definitely does it. I for example can comfortable edit, compile and debug my code written in C++ and other languages locally and on remote servers with fast turnaround. VS code is the closest thing ever to come to a full blown modern IDE. Replicating this complete functionality and plugin ecosyste…

Rust is pretty much the most important programming language in the world right now. Using it to eliminate entire classes of bugs is a huge win for developers everywhere.

Re: Web IDE Beta

#122

Post by vultour »

aliswe wrote: post #55

I just want to ask: Why? Is this really something that will benefit Gitlab in the short, mid or long term?

It will certainly benefit me as a user. I frequently use the current web editor for small changes and it's really not that great.

Re: Web IDE Beta

#123

Post by anthonypasq »

mikro2nd wrote: post #113
kristopolous wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or maybe Microsoft is done being a bastard. It's a different group of people steering the ship then it was 25 years ago. I know how fun it is to presume they are being exclusively evil but who knows, things can change

Or maybe not. It's harder to change an organisational DNA than just changing the people. tl;dr: MS is still evil.

its not that hard to change it over the course of 25 years when 99.99% of the employees are different people

Re: Web IDE Beta

#124

Post by andrew_ »

TAForObvReasons wrote: post #8
epolanski wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the biggest risk for those companies (see GitPod who had multiple blog posts about it) is that the good parts of VSC really are closed source or not MIT-licensed so you can't use things like share or extensions and many others. I think cloud vendors like gitlab and others should actually work on rewriting or maintaining a different fork or write an entirely different web editor altogether. VSC is not a piece…

VSCodium, aka VSCode without the Microsoft proprietary bits, uses https://open-vsx.org/ as the extension registry. The hard problem is convincing devs to cross-publish

I have a few extensions, notably an update to subtle-brackets, which I cross-published. It's relatively painless - Eclipse running Open VSX is clunky, but no more clunky and UX-weird than the marketplace (which holy shit, talk about terrible UX). The issue is that VSCodium has holes, and not all extensions will run correctly.

I'd like to see a hard fork for VSCodium, where the community could make UX/DX upgrades that VSCode's Microsoft-employed gatekeepers have summarily shut down time and time again (see: issues on the find/replace dialogs)

Re: Web IDE Beta

#125

Post by kristopolous »

mikro2nd wrote: post #113
kristopolous wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or maybe Microsoft is done being a bastard. It's a different group of people steering the ship then it was 25 years ago. I know how fun it is to presume they are being exclusively evil but who knows, things can change

Or maybe not. It's harder to change an organisational DNA than just changing the people. tl;dr: MS is still evil.

That corporate strategy has failed them recently.

They had been doing mobile ever since the mostly fiction pen windows (which became windows CE a few years later) in 1992 but lost that battle so hard with things like Kin and Lumia they dropped out. And let's forget about Zune.

At one point they has 95% of the browser market but lost that so much that they completely abandoned their browser engine.

Despite all the money they've thrown at projects like Surface and Bing, they have failed to come anywhere near a dominant position. Even in gaming consoles, which has been fairly successful, they're still in 3rd place behind Sony and Nintendo after over 20 years.

Their cloud azure is nowhere near AWS ... being a barbarian emperor hasn't been working for them for a long time and demanding the 1970s IBM style vertically integrated infrastructure is not a luxury they have.

Re: Web IDE Beta

#126

Post by matkoniecz »

andrew_ wrote: post #116
matkoniecz wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If someone is a purist and wants to use it to avoid lock-in - it is available at https://github.com/VSCodium/vscodium

I gave this an earnest try over the course of a few months. There were notable bugs in nearly all of the extensions I needed to use for work. It's known that Microsoft ships custom builds of the open source portion of VS Code, and there's certainly something missing from the open source core. I ended up going back to hobbled Atom while I wait for projects like Zed to mature.

And I am simply not using extensions. (Viable for me, may be not viable for others.)

Re: Web IDE Beta

#127

Post by zamalek »

vladvasiliu wrote: post #62
morelisp wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

JetBrains seems to be forging ahead with their own Space project and not trying to partner too closely with any existing forge. They seem to understand "IDE-in-browser" undermines their fundamental market position; they need to make people not need the browser in the first place, to retain it.

> They seem to understand "IDE-in-browser" undermines their fundamental market position How so? They've recently rolled out the "gateway" product, which is basically a remote IDE. Sure, you still connect to that with a local one, but the local one doesn't do that much. Why not move it to a browser? The remote one does all the things people love about their IDEs. And if people don't care, they're probably not using th…

There's actually a few products.

Gateway is a remote IDE in the browser, it's a rewrite of their front-end (Spring I think?) to marshal the UI over HTTP.

Remote is similar to VSCode. The IDE is split into a front-end and a backend: the UI stuff happens locally, and does RPC to the backend for file access, terminal, language server, what-not.

Re: Web IDE Beta

#128

Post by silverwind »

Shorel wrote: post #51
terminal_d wrote: post #31

Anyone think there'll be another editor that'll surpass VSCode, similar to how VSCode surpassed Atom (and others)? I used to think that there would be one, but now I'm not so sure.

It depends on who you ask. Personally, I still prefer Sublime Text to VSCode. Now, the problem is ST is proprietary, but then VSCode is starting to be proprietary as well.

Sublime Text is still considerable faster than VSCode, and also has LSP via plugins, but its development again has grinded to a halt, which seems to be something that happens periodically when the team decides to focus on other products.

Re: Web IDE Beta

#129

Post by StevePerkins »

FpUser wrote: post #120
StevePerkins wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At the end of the day, VS Code is a shitty Electron app. It's one of the most highly optimized and performant Electron apps ever created... but it's still a shitty Electron app. Startup time on my machine is only a hair faster than Jetbrains IDE's launching a JVM, it's ridiculous. VS Code has the market share that it has because: 1. They encouraged a huge plugin ecosystem. 2. They made it cross-platform and gave it a…

>"At the end of the day, VS Code is a shitty Electron app. " It provides huge practical value to me as a developer. I am not fond of JavaScript being used as front end but as long as it performs decent job for particular use case I do not care. I use development tools to develop products and make money. I do not fight holy tech wars. >"Startup time on my machine is only a hair faster than Jetbrains IDE's launching a…

For someone who starts by saying they don't fight tech holy wars, this sure does read like a tech holy war.

I am not insulting your personal identity by disparaging your choice in text editor. I am responding to a question of what could cause a future competitor to take the top spot away from VS Code.

My answer is that VS Code has inherent challenges from being built atop an embedded web browser, and that a similar implementation based on direct native executables may be the path through which it's successor will emerge. Carry on.

Re: Web IDE Beta

#130

Post by FpUser »

bitwize wrote: post #121
FpUser wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rust - I would not give rat's ass about what language was used to write an IDE as long as it performs adequately. VS Code definitely does it. I for example can comfortable edit, compile and debug my code written in C++ and other languages locally and on remote servers with fast turnaround. VS code is the closest thing ever to come to a full blown modern IDE. Replicating this complete functionality and plugin ecosyste…

Rust is pretty much the most important programming language in the world right now. Using it to eliminate entire classes of bugs is a huge win for developers everywhere.

As already said I do not care. I would not trade shitty app written in "proper" language over one that is not but does the actual useful work for me.

>"...eliminate entire classes of bugs..."

With modern C++, static analyzers and address sanitizers this aspect of Rust does not matter that much for me personally. As a language Rust looks way more restricted to me than a modern C++ and dancing around borrow checker is far from fun. Unless explicitly required by contract I do not see it as a business case with positive ROI for me. I run my own company and I actually pay for development.

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