Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Wells Fargo to pay $3.7B for mistreating customers

finance.yahoo.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 465 posts

Re: Wells Fargo to pay $3.7B for mistreating customers

#71

Post by pksebben »

twblalock wrote: post #20
ProAm wrote: post #8

WIth two massive scandals within 5 years I think this bank should be broken up as part of its punishment. It's clearly too big to run an honest consumer safe business.

What about the 268,000 employees who work at Wells Fargo, 99% of whom had nothing to do with this? Most of those employees are just normal people trying to make a living, and it would be wrong to screw them because their bosses, who they never met or had anything to do with, did something wrong. Shutting down a company is the nuclear option -- it hurts many people who did nothing wrong, including most of the employee…

I'm more worried about their 70 million customers than the relatively paltry 300k employees

Re: Wells Fargo to pay $3.7B for mistreating customers

#72

Post by kodyo »

dimitrios1 wrote: post #65
kodyo wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Banks would rightly collapse if people took their business to credit unions. No random violence required.

Credit unions are all the rage when the economy is roaring, but they are typically the first to run into issues or fold on first sight of troubled waters. Their history is full of examples of having to be rescued by the federal government, including all the times commercial banks had to be rescued. The main difference in my view is struggling commercial banks get absorbed, where as struggling credit unions close. I a…

I did a thought experiment. If FDIC and NCUA deposit insurance didn't exist, would I trust a bank of a credit union more with my deposits? I landed with credit unions due to the overt malfeasance of banks.

The FDIC exists to keep banks afloat, because they're untrustworthy on their own.

Re: Wells Fargo to pay $3.7B for mistreating customers

#73

Post by pertymcpert »

willcipriano wrote: post #13

My father taught me that if you are going to steal from someone you never steal his tools or his vehicle, because those are the means he uses to make a living and you dont want to be responsible for his kids going hungry. Given this history of Wells Fargo this isn't a one off accident. It's often said but people really need to go to prison for this, not club fed either, send them to be with the other carjackers.

Why did your father say that to you?

Re: Wells Fargo to pay $3.7B for mistreating customers

#75

Post by pwinnski »

dimitrios1 wrote: post #65
kodyo wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Banks would rightly collapse if people took their business to credit unions. No random violence required.

Credit unions are all the rage when the economy is roaring, but they are typically the first to run into issues or fold on first sight of troubled waters. Their history is full of examples of having to be rescued by the federal government, including all the times commercial banks had to be rescued. The main difference in my view is struggling commercial banks get absorbed, where as struggling credit unions close. I a…

I don't think much of this is true. While corporate credit unions did participate in TARP[0], for example, that's not the common perception. Not only were they primarily corporate credit unions rather than consumer credit unions, far fewer of them participated in the program than banks: around 20% as many.

For people, credit union accounts are federally insured just like bank accounts are, but credit unions are typically much more resilient than banks given the additional restrictions on how much leverage they can engage in. They close less often than banks, and also seem to be more likely to merge than close[1], contrary to your claim.

You're welcome to keep banking elsewhere, but it's all credit unions for me and my extended family.

0. https://thefinancialbrand.com/news/bank-culture/tarp-on-cred...

1. https://www.bankrate.com/banking/credit-unions/list-of-faile...

Re: Wells Fargo to pay $3.7B for mistreating customers

#76

Post by groffee »

aschearer wrote: post #62
obblekk wrote: post #9

I feel so much cognitive dissonance realizing that there are hard working people literally losing their home and shelter wrongly while I might be sitting across from them at any time, expecting them to behave within normal social boundaries. Imagine a family with a new born, working 50+ hours at a physically demanding job, making $80k/yr combined, and then losing their home for no reason... and then being expected to…

A long time ago someone wrote, "they have nothing to lose but their chains" and predicted massive social upheaval as a result. That person felt this was an inevitable consequence of capitalism and its tendency to concentrate wealth. I suspect they were imagining people like in your example, only worse off. Maybe redirecting that anger against another segment of society is a way to avoid social upheaval while maintain…

That "person" was Rousseau and his writings contributed to the French Revolution.

Re: Wells Fargo to pay $3.7B for mistreating customers

#77

Post by twblalock »

pksebben wrote: post #68
_skel wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Example number ten thousand of why the "vote with your dollars and don't do business with them" defense of capitalism fails completely in practice. Example number ten thousand of how everything bad is blamed on "capitalism." It's a lazy, shallow, knee-jerk reaction that is plaguing this site and ought to be forbidden by the guidelines. When you apply for a mortgage you are informed in advance that it might be sold.…

your analysis of the situation as being interchangeable is rendered invalid by the story you're responding to, and claiming "you should have read the fine print" is clearly bad faith in an era where EULAs are a half mile long. Also, to say "don't buy it if you don't like it" ignores a whole ton of a nuanced and complex situation, where there might not be better alternatives. I would be more than happy to discuss why…

I never said anything about reading the fine print. I had to sign a short, readable form by hand which was explained to me in person by the lender. They are very, very up front about this (which is also required by law, which means everyone else in the US who got a mortgage in the past decade or two has also signed this form).

Re: Wells Fargo to pay $3.7B for mistreating customers

#78

Post by AYBABTME »

cool_dude85 wrote: post #66
mrtksn wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a question, do people really protest in designated areas in the US? I know sometimes there are riots but from what I can see on the media it looks like people gather somewhere close to the subject and chant and wave banners. I find it strange because in Europe the norm is to disturb the daily life. Farmers spray policemen with milk, train operators stop working, the younger and more anarchist ones burn cars an…

In the US, the police (and people not involved in the protests) will happily beat you up, run you over, or shoot and kill you for disruptive protests.

I mean, they won't just happily do _all_ of that. You're exaggerating a bit and using extreme cases as if they were the norm. In particular you may say this with a straight face only if you're unaware of how this actually is the common reality of other countries.

We've all heard of cases of police running over crowds in some circumstances, or of the odd shooting (actually when?). But that's not what the average protester in the US will realistically, honestly deal with on the average protest.

Re: Wells Fargo to pay $3.7B for mistreating customers

#79

Post by paxys »

silisili wrote: post #17

Why is it -always- Wells Fargo. There are thousands of banks out there, and Wells Fargo is not even close to being the biggest. But why are they in the news every year for some illegal dealings? It feels like they should be broken up or something at this point.

> and Wells Fargo is not even close to being the biggest

Wells Fargo is the 2nd largest mortgage lender in the USA (after Quicken), #4 bank in terms of assets under management, #3 by market cap, #2 in number of branches. It is absolutely massive.

Re: Wells Fargo to pay $3.7B for mistreating customers

#80

Post by aschearer »

groffee wrote: post #76
aschearer wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A long time ago someone wrote, "they have nothing to lose but their chains" and predicted massive social upheaval as a result. That person felt this was an inevitable consequence of capitalism and its tendency to concentrate wealth. I suspect they were imagining people like in your example, only worse off. Maybe redirecting that anger against another segment of society is a way to avoid social upheaval while maintain…

That "person" was Rousseau and his writings contributed to the French Revolution.

Close. It was Marx I was thinking of. Not endorsing him, but it's interesting to consider historical materialism and today's events -- especially in light of the parent's comment.
Post reply on HN