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Paul Graham is leaving Twitter for now

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Re: Paul Graham is leaving Twitter for now

#941

Post by LastTrain »

pg wrote: post #350

I'm not leaving Twitter. It seems more likely than not that Elon will reverse the ban on links to other social media sites. I just don't want to hang out there in the meantime. Plus given the way things are going, it seemed like a good time to learn about alternatives. I still think Elon is a smart guy. His work on cars and rockets speaks for itself. Nor do I think he's the villain a lot of people try to make him out…

He can be good at rockets and cars and still be a villain. Being eccentric on its own doesn’t involve victimizing innocents, which he does on the regular…

Re: Paul Graham is leaving Twitter for now

#942

Post by jacquesm »

kharak wrote: post #933
jacquesm wrote: post #511

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rule #1 of any forum is don't moderate the forum that you are active on. Musk is finding out the hard way why this is the case. Happy to see your post here though! Edit: and while we have you here briefly, Happy Holidays!

Huh, I'm one of several mods for a Sub-Reddit. Works fine. Only things that changed are a) my own comment quality standard is higher and b) the way I read other comments. Now, I scan comments for rule infractions, which lessens my reading enjoyment a bit. Also never observed a problem between mods and other users in other Sub-Reddits. Maybe because mods on Reddit are not that visible?

Depends on the subject matter as well. I've moderated a - large - forum for years and in the beginning I was also a user of the site. That quickly led to people figuring out that the moderator is a part of the scene and so you get people that try to get into your good book and others that try to set each other up. Every word you write gets lawyered over and so on. If your Sub-Reddit doesn't have those problems count yourself lucky. But personally I think that the way dang here does it is perfect (see: sucking up ;) ), he only enters the conversation to explain his moderation actions, but does not actually take a position on any of the issues discussed, thus leading to perceived impartiality (he still gets plenty of flak but imo that is undeserved).

Re: Paul Graham is leaving Twitter for now

#943

Post by tootie »

ssnistfajen wrote: post #831
tootie wrote: post #581

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everyone shrugged off the "pedo guy" episode as a lapse of judgment and not a glimpse into his real personality.

Musk did publicly apologize to the diver and the courts ruled that Musk was not liable, so lots of people considered it a settled matter. I considered Musk a cool tech person before that event, then a weird tech person after that. Since 2020 though he has turned into just an awful tech person.

Apologies and atonement are one thing but I think it takes a certain level of emotional deficiency to even have the impulse to use your position of power to lob such petty insults. It's grossly abnormal. Same thing for people like Kanye West or Will Smith. They can tap dance between insane behavior and apologizing but like why would they ever do the things they do in the first place if they were decent people.

Re: Paul Graham is leaving Twitter for now

#944

Post by elliekelly »

ehsankia wrote: post #847
elliekelly wrote: post #417

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is absolutely true. But I think “smart” leadership avoids repeatedly doubling down on their mistakes. You can, very rarely, double down on what looks like a bad bet and come out ahead. I’m not even sure I’d call that smart but it does happen. But it takes a not-smart person to see the losses stacking up over and over and decide to dig in their heels. Even if you’re absolutely certain your goals and overall strat…

I really don't want to be defending Elon, but I think saying "Elon must be stupid because of how he handled Twitter" is as silly as "Elon had success with Tesla and SpaceX therefore he knows how to run companies". Those two seem like two extremes. The answer seems more along the lines of, Twitter and its problems are very very different from Tesla/SpaceX, and while Elon may have been good at the latter, he has zero e…

Yes I think it’s probably more accurate to say his problems stem from ego & arrogance rather than stupidity.

Re: Paul Graham is leaving Twitter for now

#945

Post by jacquesm »

patrec wrote: post #914
jacquesm wrote: post #603

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any good examples? 'Reputation is like a crystal vase, you can drop it, and glue it back together again but it will never again be the same vase that it was before you dropped it'.

Both Bill Gates (IT robber baron) and Mike Tyson (wife beater, ear biter and convicted rapist) seem to enjoy pretty good reputations these days. Musk's reputational problem is chiefly due to looking quite incompetent at the moment, not his moral failings.

> Both Bill Gates (IT robber baron) and Mike Tyson (wife beater, ear biter and convicted rapist) seem to enjoy pretty good reputations these days.

Not in my book...

Re: Paul Graham is leaving Twitter for now

#946

Post by rhaksw »

kharak wrote: post #933
jacquesm wrote: post #511

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rule #1 of any forum is don't moderate the forum that you are active on. Musk is finding out the hard way why this is the case. Happy to see your post here though! Edit: and while we have you here briefly, Happy Holidays!

Huh, I'm one of several mods for a Sub-Reddit. Works fine. Only things that changed are a) my own comment quality standard is higher and b) the way I read other comments. Now, I scan comments for rule infractions, which lessens my reading enjoyment a bit. Also never observed a problem between mods and other users in other Sub-Reddits. Maybe because mods on Reddit are not that visible?

> Huh, I'm one of several mods for a Sub-Reddit. Works fine.

Reddit is mostly anonymous, which can make people think they can do whatever they want as moderators/users without any repercussions. Of course that isn't true: all of our actions impact our own behavior, attitude etc.

> Also never observed a problem between mods and other users in other Sub-Reddits. Maybe because mods on Reddit are not that visible?

It happens all the time. These r/Libertarian [1] and r/LibertarianUncensored [2] threads may be the most succinct examples of how far users/mods will go to make their voices heard. I list many more in my talk [3].

[1] https://archive.ph/O0GN8#selection-2701.0-2707.56

[2] https://www.reddit.com/r/LibertarianUncensored/comments/uotv...

[3] https://shadowmoderation.com/2022-10-transparent-moderation/

Re: Paul Graham is leaving Twitter for now

#947

Post by phpisthebest »

secos wrote: post #932
phpisthebest wrote: post #827

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Silicon Valley CA where the only politics is left, and even more left. Twitter post Elon is Awesome, They are crying foul now that rules are actually being evenly enforced instead of just on the right. The activists that claim to be journalists having to follow actual rules for once in their life What is the saying... To the privileged equality looks like oppression, well that is what the Activists that work for main…

Do you still feel this way after they suspended PG?

I disagree with the rule, however the rule was broken so yes I still feel the same

My number one complaint about Twitter, YT, Twitch, or any other large platform is the arbitrary and uneven enforcement of rules, Person A does action and gets nothing, person B does same action get permabanned, often as a result of their political influence, notoriety, internal connections, or in the case of twitter often just being of the "correct" political party

I would prefer a different rules set, always have for twitter but if they are going to have a rule it absolutely unquestionably needs to be enforced equally across the platform.

Re: Paul Graham is leaving Twitter for now

#948

Post by areuokbroareu »

jacquesm wrote: post #511
pg wrote: post #498

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks, but as I learned when I was running HN, being a regular user of a forum (which the moderator necessarily is) and writing essays are fundamentally incompatible. If you're known to be a regular user of a forum, then when someone says something about you and you don't reply, it reads as a tacit admission that they're correct. And when you write essays people say all kinds of things about you. The combination is…

Rule #1 of any forum is don't moderate the forum that you are active on. Musk is finding out the hard way why this is the case. Happy to see your post here though! Edit: and while we have you here briefly, Happy Holidays!

No post body was provided.

Re: Paul Graham is leaving Twitter for now

#949

Post by LastTrain »

kmlx wrote: post #850
samtp wrote: post #606

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well he did very publicly call the cave diver who saved 12 children a pedophile because he was jealous of him. He also called for a leading infectious disease expert to be jailed, further endangering someone who was already under armed protection from previous threats. And there was that one time that he shared an unfounded conspiracy theory about an elderly man who was attacked with a hammer in his own home. There w…

> Well he did very publicly call the cave diver who saved 12 children a pedophile because he was jealous of him. this is false. he called him that after the cave diver told Musk to “stick his submarine where it hurts”. it only takes 1 minute to search google.

All you’ve done is confirm that Musk called the cave diver a pedo, to which the only proper reply os “yeah that was fucked up”

Re: Paul Graham is leaving Twitter for now

#950

Post by ip26 »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #37
belligeront wrote: post #15

Amazing that just a month ago he tweeted[1]: "It's remarkable how many people who've never run any kind of company think they know how to run a tech company better than someone who's run Tesla and SpaceX.". It's been fascinating watching so many VC types ignore so many red flags just because some of Elon's early actions validated their priors (e.g. tech companies are bloated and need to layoff staff). [1] https://twi…

The hubris is what gets me. The sheer audacity that the peons had in suggesting Musk didn't know what he was doing!

It’s hubris to question the authority? I thought it was a fundamental American pastime.
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