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Winter & Cold Weather EV Range Loss in 7,000 Cars

recurrentauto.com

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Re: Winter & Cold Weather EV Range Loss in 7,000 Cars

#41

Post by remarkEon »

crazygringo wrote: post #16

I find it strange that the charts only go down to 20°F, when for example at the moment I write this comment, it's -5°F (-21°C) in Bismarck, North Dakota. And sub-zero Fahrenheit temperatures are pretty common in the winter across the Northeast, especially at night. "Normal" driving conditions extend way below just 20°F.

Came here to say that (am in Minnesota for Christmas holiday, where it’s currently 1°). It gets much colder than 20°F for extended periods in the Midwest. Is there just not a large enough sample of EV driving in those temperatures to extend the graph?

Re: Winter & Cold Weather EV Range Loss in 7,000 Cars

#43

Post by Someone1234 »

cameronh90 wrote: post #30

My fuel economy drops about 20% on my petrol car in cold weather city driving. I don't know what causes the difference, perhaps waiting for the car to warm up and windows to defrost.

EVs upsides and downsides should be considered without it needing to be a comparison to ICE. But, yes, running the heater will use fuel.

In this case EVs with "250 miles" range are losing 30%~ of that range for three months of the year and a further 20% over the first three years of their life, making them reliably closer to a 140-mile vehicle. People who are planning round-trip travel or commuting need to know this information, and unfortunately a lot of EV fans like to mock people for wanting high initial EV range as if winter and or capacity loss aren't real (even with the facts being readily available).

The Bolt is currently the best budget EV by far, but people buying it should consider it a 150-mile range vehicle with "bonus" miles above that.

Re: Winter & Cold Weather EV Range Loss in 7,000 Cars

#44

Post by Someone1234 »

whoisthemachine wrote: post #11

Interesting data, but for the Model 3, I think an important piece is missing: model year. Around 2021 they switched out the resistive cabin heating for heat pump heating, which had a positive impact on cold weather range. Anecdotally speaking, my 2020 Model 3 gets between a 30-40% range hit in the winter.

This article is about battery capacity loss due to cold weather (either directly or due to use of battery-heaters). Cabin heating is over and above the loss discussed here.

Re: Winter & Cold Weather EV Range Loss in 7,000 Cars

#45

Post by jeffbee »

cameronh90 wrote: post #30

My fuel economy drops about 20% on my petrol car in cold weather city driving. I don't know what causes the difference, perhaps waiting for the car to warm up and windows to defrost.

Same and I don't even get cold weather here on the Pacific coast, just high 30s at worst. The engine on my hybrid runs a lot more in colder weather trying to heat itself and the cabin, even with the cabin thermostat set to 65. For short trips around town I get MPGs in the teens while in the summer I would normally expect 50+ MPG.

Re: Winter & Cold Weather EV Range Loss in 7,000 Cars

#46

Post by markus_zhang »

Wait, judging from some comments people actually take heating and winter tires into consideration when calculating differences in mileage?

But I have to disagree. You have to use heating and winter tires during winter. The correct calculation should be take that out first and then compare the numbers. For example if heating and winter tires take say 100 miles, full mileage says 500, but car stops around 300 miles, then it loses 100 miles, not 200 miles. For sure ordinary people don't know how many miles heating and winter tires take away but researchers should be able to test them separately.

Re: Winter & Cold Weather EV Range Loss in 7,000 Cars

#47

Post by quickthrowman »

crazygringo wrote: post #16

I find it strange that the charts only go down to 20°F, when for example at the moment I write this comment, it's -5°F (-21°C) in Bismarck, North Dakota. And sub-zero Fahrenheit temperatures are pretty common in the winter across the Northeast, especially at night. "Normal" driving conditions extend way below just 20°F.

Agreed, I’m in MN and it’s 5F. Starting next Wednesday, we have a forecast for 5 days in a row where the highest temp is 4F.

Re: Winter & Cold Weather EV Range Loss in 7,000 Cars

#48

Post by joshgachnang »

davedx wrote: post #3

Yup my wife just almost got stranded in her Mach-e. Fantastic car but cold weather battery is noticeably worse than our Model 3’s. Something to keep in mind.

Ford's decision to forgo a heat pump is a real head scratcher. Sad the Lightning didn't make the page, because I'm very interested how much it affects it.

Re: Winter & Cold Weather EV Range Loss in 7,000 Cars

#49

Post by kevin_thibedeau »

cameronh90 wrote: post #30

My fuel economy drops about 20% on my petrol car in cold weather city driving. I don't know what causes the difference, perhaps waiting for the car to warm up and windows to defrost.

Cold air is denser and takes more work to push through.

Re: Winter & Cold Weather EV Range Loss in 7,000 Cars

#50

Post by Arech »

cameronh90 wrote: post #30

My fuel economy drops about 20% on my petrol car in cold weather city driving. I don't know what causes the difference, perhaps waiting for the car to warm up and windows to defrost.

Warming up the whole car (including grease in wheel hub bearings, for example, that becomes much harder in cold) takes a lot of energy, so perhaps it is it. I'd say that a fully warmed car though should be a bit more efficient due to a bigger temperature difference and a bigger oxygen amount going into cylinders.
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