Earlier quoted context omitted.
> irrigated feed crops Simple solution - those who believe that is the problem can offer to buy the water rights and then let the water flow.
simply?
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Fears of ‘dead pool’ on Colorado River as drought threatens Hoover Dam water
11–20 of 154 posts
Re: Fears of ‘dead pool’ on Colorado River as drought threatens Hoover Dam water
#12Earlier quoted context omitted.
Watch 2-3 episodes of 'How it's Made' and you can see how much water use is industrial. Add the industrial and cattle together and one can quickly see that it's not humans that are consuming the vast majority of potable water, but companies and industry that are depleting what's available for the rest of us.
Just because some people may not grasp this: it is still individual humans consuming the water. Companies and industry don’t burn resources for no reason, they become products that consumers buy. The only real solution is that we consumers consume less, and probably spend more for the same products, period.
> The only real solution is that we consumers consume less, and probably spend more for the same products, period.
I couldn’t disagree more. We need more regulation and taxation, and the real cost of the externalities added to the end product. The public is subsidizing and paying for private industry to pollute and use resources without accountability. That needs to end. The idea that the problem is solely due to personal consumption by individuals is a greenwashing tactic used by corporations to avoid responsibility for their products. The real solution is to put up barriers to producing these products and make the companies pay for their impact on the planet. This strange, antisocial idea that companies aren’t part of the social contract and don’t have to follow the rules of governments and civilization needs to be called out.
Re: Fears of ‘dead pool’ on Colorado River as drought threatens Hoover Dam water
#13Earlier quoted context omitted.
Watch 2-3 episodes of 'How it's Made' and you can see how much water use is industrial. Add the industrial and cattle together and one can quickly see that it's not humans that are consuming the vast majority of potable water, but companies and industry that are depleting what's available for the rest of us.
> it's not humans that are consuming the vast majority of potable water, but companies and industry that are depleting what's available for the rest of us. companies only make what they can sell. The sell what consumers want. So it is humans. Humans want meat. If they stop wanting meat companies will stop making meat.
A huge reason companies use so much water is that it's artificially cheap. Companies typically pay 10% or less of the cost per gallon a resident does in their home.
Re: Fears of ‘dead pool’ on Colorado River as drought threatens Hoover Dam water
#14This is the downside of a more decentralized country. In many nations with more centralized control, the federal government would simply come up with a plan and each smaller jurisdiction would have to do what they were told.
But the USA requires a meeting of "officials from seven states, water agencies, tribes and the federal government" to negotiate, and continually fail to come to any agreement.
Each will blame the others, nothing will get done, and everyone will lose, all to avoid not getting the best deal for themselves.
Re: Fears of ‘dead pool’ on Colorado River as drought threatens Hoover Dam water
#15Earlier quoted context omitted.
Watch 2-3 episodes of 'How it's Made' and you can see how much water use is industrial. Add the industrial and cattle together and one can quickly see that it's not humans that are consuming the vast majority of potable water, but companies and industry that are depleting what's available for the rest of us.
> it's not humans that are consuming the vast majority of potable water, but companies and industry that are depleting what's available for the rest of us. companies only make what they can sell. The sell what consumers want. So it is humans. Humans want meat. If they stop wanting meat companies will stop making meat.
> If they stop wanting meat companies will stop making meat.
If companies start paying the total costs (water, carbon)—including externalities—of their raw materials, and pass those costs onto consumers, perhaps things will rebalance.
Re: Fears of ‘dead pool’ on Colorado River as drought threatens Hoover Dam water
#16Federal lawmakers need to get over the history of water rights here. The system was built on assumptions that just don't hold (more water was apportioned than ever flows).
You can give each state an amount and let them figure it out, or take all existing rights and re allocate them federally.
But it needs to happen, and urgently.
"But people will lose their income!" - Thats a symptom of requiring these people to work so wastefully to survive. UBI and other safety nets reduce the need to do this specific work for profit.
"But my luxuries will be more expensive!" - No, your luxuries are just being priced at what they cost, and the burden of the environmental damage is no longer hidden from you
"Big government bad!" - I get it, I'm an anarchist. But when you have to protect a massive river, it's clear we cannot rely on all the individuals to do the right thing.
Re: Fears of ‘dead pool’ on Colorado River as drought threatens Hoover Dam water
#17Earlier quoted context omitted.
Watch 2-3 episodes of 'How it's Made' and you can see how much water use is industrial. Add the industrial and cattle together and one can quickly see that it's not humans that are consuming the vast majority of potable water, but companies and industry that are depleting what's available for the rest of us.
Just because some people may not grasp this: it is still individual humans consuming the water. Companies and industry don’t burn resources for no reason, they become products that consumers buy. The only real solution is that we consumers consume less, and probably spend more for the same products, period.
> Companies and industry don’t burn resources for no reason, they become products that consumers buy.
If companies start paying the total costs—including externalities (water, carbon)—of their raw materials, and pass those costs onto consumers, perhaps things will rebalance.
Re: Fears of ‘dead pool’ on Colorado River as drought threatens Hoover Dam water
#18Earlier quoted context omitted.
> irrigated feed crops Simple solution - those who believe that is the problem can offer to buy the water rights and then let the water flow.
simply?
OK, how about 'make an adequate offer'. At least try to get some politicians and celebrities to endorse a gofundme effort.
Re: Fears of ‘dead pool’ on Colorado River as drought threatens Hoover Dam water
#19Earlier quoted context omitted.
> it's not humans that are consuming the vast majority of potable water, but companies and industry that are depleting what's available for the rest of us. companies only make what they can sell. The sell what consumers want. So it is humans. Humans want meat. If they stop wanting meat companies will stop making meat.
> If they stop wanting meat companies will stop making meat. If companies start paying the total costs (water, carbon)—including externalities—of their raw materials, and pass those costs onto consumers, perhaps things will rebalance.
Consider having militaries do externality accounting. First obvious thing to discover is the engine pollution controls are deleted 'because war'.
Re: Fears of ‘dead pool’ on Colorado River as drought threatens Hoover Dam water
#20Federal lawmakers need to get over the history of water rights here. The system was built on assumptions that just don't hold (more water was apportioned than ever flows). You can give each state an amount and let them figure it out, or take all existing rights and re allocate them federally. But it needs to happen, and urgently. "But people will lose their income!" - Thats a symptom of requiring these people to work…
Also, UBI is often the cheapest and most efficient way to prop people out of poverty and (surprised?) to support their ambitions in education, starting business etc.