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Atom was archived today

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Re: Atom was archived today

#541

Post by lanstin »

throwaway14356 wrote: post #299
p-e-w wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> All good tools need getting to know them Wrong. Good tools don't require that. Imagine someone showed you a complicated mechanical contraption and told you "it's a type of hammer, much better than the 'non-professional' hammer, but you need to 'get to know it' first". That product would be dead on arrival. Great tools are obvious in their base functionality and have optional additional layers that can be discovered…

I wouldn't put it that blunt but I do agree. The problem are these nerds with seemingly infinite memory. It is almost impossible for them to make a UI for the rest of us. I tried editing a txt document in vim one time. After gazing at the UI for much to long I had to ask for help because it wouldn't let me edit the txt. I'm sure your average vim wizard can see no wrong in forcing new users to learn how to engage edit…

The key for learning a profession is to dump as much knowledge as possible into your 'muscle memory'. there are many operations in emacs and vi that i can do when i want to, but i might not be able to pull up the key sequence to tell someone. Like a musical instrument, the key is practise, practise, practise.

I don't feel like i have proficiency in a language until i have forced myself to speed run a few projects in it. The ideas are important, but it is the ingrained habits that keep the code clean and consistent.

I mean if you don't want to spend so much time studying a given profession, of course. But the neural positioning of generating this text, or transform this text' is different than the neural positioning of 'should this call to this new to me gRPC server be blocking? Timeout? Retries?'

The latter takes thorough focus. the former can be done by muscle memory with practise, and the limit is more on how many new things your fingers can learn in a month, the total of learned things can be quite high.

Re: Atom was archived today

#542

Post by spmurrayzzz »

flakeoil wrote: post #261
hnlmorg wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

VSCode is good but as someone who’s been writing software for nearly 40 years, I really feel you’ve over doing the compliments by a long long way. Compilers, operating systems, browser engines (unfortunately) and reverse engineering proprietary hardware/firmware are all significantly harder challenges than writing an IDE. in fact there have been excellent IDEs around for decades before VSCode came along. Yes the indu…

Spot on. And I would rather say that Atom was an engineering feat in terms of that they developed Electron and tree-sitter. One also has to take into account that Atom started long before VS Code so for sure the VS Code team could make much more informed decisions and learn from the "failures" of Atom. And things like TypeScript wasn't around when Atom started.

Admittedly this is a little bit of a nitpick (and I agree with your general sentiment re: VSCode devs benefitting from prior art) but for clarity's sake — Atom v1.0.0 was released mid-2015. TypeScript v1.0 was early 2014 and had been usable since 2012 pre 1.0.

They were very much contemporaries of one another, though obviously TS popularity has surged since 2017/2018.

Re: Atom was archived today

#543

Post by rahen »

LorenDB wrote: post #502
Maken wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are definitely over-hyping VS Code, but it definitely has a killer feature: being the only modern IDE (Sublime Text aside) that doesn't slow to a crawl when opening any file larger than a few hundred lines of code.

Qt Creator has been just fine for me. Granted, it may take a few seconds to generate syntax highlighting, but it seems very usable to me.

Qt Creator is what advise to newcomers who aren't yet familiar with the terminal. Unlike VSCode, its C/C++ debugger is first class, and it's a native binary developed in a high efficiency language.

Re: Atom was archived today

#544

Post by crispyambulance »

p-e-w wrote: post #75
esprehn wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Atom predated the LSP and leaned heavily into customizations with all the plugins running inside the UI thread (more like a traditional web page and 3p scripts). At the time they viewed the extreme customization support as a feature, and there was a thriving ecosystem of folks making plugins. That architecture has a major flaw though. A default install was fast, but a real configuration with all the plugins ended up…

VSCode is one of the greatest pieces of engineering of our time. It's really only when you compare it with Atom that you realize how great it is. Atom was built by incredibly smart people, who had full control over the platform and several years of head start, and they were still out-engineered by the VSCode team at every turn. VSCode did almost everything right: The choice of TypeScript as the base language (with wh…

There is one thing that I will always remember ATOM for, and I don't mean this as a joke, it _really_ was awesome: The ATOM 1.0 Launch video (https://youtu.be/Y7aEiVwBAdk)

Re: Atom was archived today

#545

Post by gen220 »

albrewer wrote: post #480
europeanguy wrote: post #383

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> nothing can touch the lightness and latency of subl There's this editor called vim. You should have a look.

For some people (like me), re-teaching muscle memory is a huge battle that takes years. Switching to an editor where you can't use the mouse as a crutch until you learn it is a non-starter.

Next time you're on an airplane and have nothing to do, but have access to a laptop, consider firing up `vimtutor`. I think you might underestimate how much time it takes to build up muscle memory in a new system. Not saying you'll be a wizard by the time you get off the flight, but it might surprise you how far you get!

Re: Atom was archived today

#546

Post by allarm »

wokwokwok wrote: post #443
opan wrote: post #400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vim and Emacs are free. This seems like the norm to me.

Yes, and when was the last time a large room of new developers told you how amazed they were at how great Emacs was? How easy it was to setup vim plugins? How seemless the experience was between Mac and windows and Linux? Literally never would be my answer. People like vscode because of the time and effort that has been spent making it friendly and approachable, yet still powerful. Those are not just things that magi…

Literally yesterday I set up Emacs on my new laptop, the Doom Emacs distribution. It took around 10 minutes overall.

The thing that surprises me most is the fact that people don’t want to learn the tools. I get the point that Emacs/Vim ecosystem is difficult to get used to because of well, multiple reasons. But it worths the time because these tools are amazing. You need to invest a couple of hours in Vim, probably some more in Emacs, but it’s just one time investment and then you have an instrument (or two) to rely on.

Re: Atom was archived today

#547

Post by ajkjk »

ddevault wrote: post #532
magicalhippo wrote: post #357

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> t was the first editor I’ve seen to choke when opening 1M file I recall trying Atom before VSCode had been released. I loaded up a 1MB XML file and it ground to a halt. After some searching I found a bug tracker issue reflecting this, where one of the devs said something to the effect of "a 1MB XML file is extremely large, I don't think we'll support that". At that point I uninstalled Atom. On a related note, not l…

2.5G is definitely excessive.

Not optimized, perhaps, but not unreasonable given the metadata over a nearly-500MB file I would think?

Re: Atom was archived today

#548

Post by magicalhippo »

ddevault wrote: post #532
magicalhippo wrote: post #357

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> t was the first editor I’ve seen to choke when opening 1M file I recall trying Atom before VSCode had been released. I loaded up a 1MB XML file and it ground to a halt. After some searching I found a bug tracker issue reflecting this, where one of the devs said something to the effect of "a 1MB XML file is extremely large, I don't think we'll support that". At that point I uninstalled Atom. On a related note, not l…

2.5G is definitely excessive.

Not sure how it represents text, but if it's using UTF-16 (I'm on Windows), then that's 900MB just there given the ASCII input file.

Not gonna say it's lightweight, but not excessive in my book.

Re: Atom was archived today

#549

Post by [deleted] »

p-e-w wrote: post #75
esprehn wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Atom predated the LSP and leaned heavily into customizations with all the plugins running inside the UI thread (more like a traditional web page and 3p scripts). At the time they viewed the extreme customization support as a feature, and there was a thriving ecosystem of folks making plugins. That architecture has a major flaw though. A default install was fast, but a real configuration with all the plugins ended up…

VSCode is one of the greatest pieces of engineering of our time. It's really only when you compare it with Atom that you realize how great it is. Atom was built by incredibly smart people, who had full control over the platform and several years of head start, and they were still out-engineered by the VSCode team at every turn. VSCode did almost everything right: The choice of TypeScript as the base language (with wh…

[deleted]

Re: Atom was archived today

#550

Post by jcdentonunatco »

p-e-w wrote: post #75
esprehn wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Atom predated the LSP and leaned heavily into customizations with all the plugins running inside the UI thread (more like a traditional web page and 3p scripts). At the time they viewed the extreme customization support as a feature, and there was a thriving ecosystem of folks making plugins. That architecture has a major flaw though. A default install was fast, but a real configuration with all the plugins ended up…

VSCode is one of the greatest pieces of engineering of our time. It's really only when you compare it with Atom that you realize how great it is. Atom was built by incredibly smart people, who had full control over the platform and several years of head start, and they were still out-engineered by the VSCode team at every turn. VSCode did almost everything right: The choice of TypeScript as the base language (with wh…

VS Code is massively inferior to Visual Studio. It’s a gloried text editor. Nobody writes large software projects on VSCode
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