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The Gates of Argonath in VR at 50 FPS on Unreal Engine

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Re: The Gates of Argonath in VR at 50 FPS on Unreal Engine

#31

Post by concordDance »

avian wrote: post #8
Tepix wrote: post #3

I think it will be commonplace to virtually walk around in movie scenes turned into 3d scenery by AI by the end of next year. I can see this turning into a real industry. Who wouldn't like to wander, fly and swim around Pandora, the world of Avatar? It will also lead to questions about the copyright of the resulting models, probably somewhat dependant on how automated this process is.

> It will also lead to questions about the copyright of the resulting models I'm sure there will be no questions there. The questions about the copyright of models like DALL-E, Stable Diffusion, etc. exist solely because it infringes on the rights of thousands of random artists all around the world. There is no one single entity with enough power to clearly oppose it so people making the models can get away with "que…

> The questions about the copyright of models like DALL-E, Stable Diffusion, etc. exist solely because it infringes on the rights of thousands of random artists all around the world

How does it infringe? Are your memories of a movie copyright infringement?

https://youtu.be/IFe9wiDfb0E

Re: The Gates of Argonath in VR at 50 FPS on Unreal Engine

#32

Post by mejutoco »

AussieWog93 wrote: post #11
Tepix wrote: post #3

I think it will be commonplace to virtually walk around in movie scenes turned into 3d scenery by AI by the end of next year. I can see this turning into a real industry. Who wouldn't like to wander, fly and swim around Pandora, the world of Avatar? It will also lead to questions about the copyright of the resulting models, probably somewhat dependant on how automated this process is.

>Who wouldn't like to wander, fly and swim around Pandora, the world of Avatar? Sure, like once or twice? I could see it getting old fast, though.

Once that stops being exciting we could tell AI to create new worlds combining others such as mixing the Smurfs and Pocahontas worlds... I wonder what it could come up with /s

Re: The Gates of Argonath in VR at 50 FPS on Unreal Engine

#33

Post by ainiriand »

causi wrote: post #15

Am I alone in thinking most of this year's Unreal Engine demonstrations are just...not that great? Like, this is what graphics looked like on the Xbox One from nine years ago: https://halo.wiki.gallery/images/1/12/H5G-Waypoint-Swords_of...

Well that screen capture is taken from a cinematic scene if I am correct. UE demonstrations are real-time playable environments.

Have you tested the Valley of the Ancients demo on your computer? You will see what I mean.

Re: The Gates of Argonath in VR at 50 FPS on Unreal Engine

#34

Post by oneoff786 »

Tepix wrote: post #3

I think it will be commonplace to virtually walk around in movie scenes turned into 3d scenery by AI by the end of next year. I can see this turning into a real industry. Who wouldn't like to wander, fly and swim around Pandora, the world of Avatar? It will also lead to questions about the copyright of the resulting models, probably somewhat dependant on how automated this process is.

> Who wouldn't like to wander, fly and swim around Pandora, the world of Avatar

This is a good example of the fundamental limits of headset VR. Jumping into a lake will never feel real. Not by touch, obviously as you can’t get wet. Not by physical movement because you almost certainly can’t move downwards irl. Not by the weight of water around you or the buoyancy you expect to feel. Not by the rotation you would expect to have in water. Probably not by the stroke propeller movement or the correlation of your breath. And of course probably overly smooth movement to avoid motion sickness.

The difference between controlling a flying camera through water and believing you’re swimming is pretty big.

Re: The Gates of Argonath in VR at 50 FPS on Unreal Engine

#35

Post by sk0g »

causi wrote: post #15

Am I alone in thinking most of this year's Unreal Engine demonstrations are just...not that great? Like, this is what graphics looked like on the Xbox One from nine years ago: https://halo.wiki.gallery/images/1/12/H5G-Waypoint-Swords_of...

That screenshot does not look rendered in game, and no idea what the resolution is - at least not by an Xbox One. If current games are indistinguishable from single-frame renders that take minutes if not hours, I'd say that's a massive win!

This looks more like the actual in-game rendering: http://cdn.themis-media.com/media/global/images/library/deri...

What stands out to me is the low resolution textures everywhere, obvious seams between terrain and assets (runtime virtual texturing resolves that), light seams which have odd seams, and the entire ambience being vaguely similar to how light acts, but not really - primarily the lack of bounce lighting affecting anything. With the move to HDR, the more binary lighting of previous games looks weird too now.

Contrast that with the rich detail in lighting you can see in Fortnite's new update - https://i.redd.it/g2wqe10no44a1.jpg

Nanite, especially foliage, is something you have to experience for yourself though. Foliage pop-in not being so stark and alarming is huge for me, and the rich lighting capabilities improves immersion massively.

Regarding assets, high polygon assets have been created for ages too, but were never actually brought in to games. You bake those details into your normal maps, but with Nanite you can just bring them into games, and get the full detail when the player is up close to them. When games can fully embrace Lumen and Nanite, the developer iteration improvement will be huge.

Re: The Gates of Argonath in VR at 50 FPS on Unreal Engine

#36

Post by moron4hire »

avian wrote: post #8
Tepix wrote: post #3

I think it will be commonplace to virtually walk around in movie scenes turned into 3d scenery by AI by the end of next year. I can see this turning into a real industry. Who wouldn't like to wander, fly and swim around Pandora, the world of Avatar? It will also lead to questions about the copyright of the resulting models, probably somewhat dependant on how automated this process is.

> It will also lead to questions about the copyright of the resulting models I'm sure there will be no questions there. The questions about the copyright of models like DALL-E, Stable Diffusion, etc. exist solely because it infringes on the rights of thousands of random artists all around the world. There is no one single entity with enough power to clearly oppose it so people making the models can get away with "que…

The copyright protected material isn't in the model. This can be figured out easily because, if they did, the models are so much smaller than the input data that it'd be literal unobtanium for compression algorithms.

Copyright also has nothing to do with the tool.

What a piece depicts and how it is used are much more important than how a piece was created. If I paint a picture by hand of a particular scene from a Disney movie, that's clearly a derived work and may be subject to copyright protection (it depends, there could be a fair use argument in specific situations, so even "it's copyright!" is not a cut-and-dried argument). If I paint a picture of Hercules in the style of Disney, that's trademark violation. But I can paint Hercules in any other style and Disney can't say shit (though they certainly try).

This is an age-old argument. Some artists think they should have a monopoly on certain ideas. As a society, we've already said no, you only get to own your expression of your ideas.

And as ideas go, "like a trending artist on ArtStation" isn't a particularly strong one.

Re: The Gates of Argonath in VR at 50 FPS on Unreal Engine

#37

Post by oneoff786 »

causi wrote: post #15

Am I alone in thinking most of this year's Unreal Engine demonstrations are just...not that great? Like, this is what graphics looked like on the Xbox One from nine years ago: https://halo.wiki.gallery/images/1/12/H5G-Waypoint-Swords_of...

Halo 9 nine years ago looked like this

https://images.app.goo.gl/wbcDbmHJhcUsxB5YA

Re: The Gates of Argonath in VR at 50 FPS on Unreal Engine

#38

Post by Daub »

huhtenberg wrote: post #12

I think it's worth taking a step back and just marveling at what's now possible to do with an off-the-shelf software. Yeah, it's "just" 50 fps, but ... would you just look at it! 4 years ago there was an equally fascinating "Paris apartment" VR demo, but the movement was limited and the amount of work that went into appears to have been orders of magnitude more - https://www.benoitdereau.com/ Go back 10 years and see…

Off the shelf yes, but wow…. The requirements for Unreal are unreal.

Recent versions handle real-time global illumination (Lumen) and dynamically render geometry to insane levels of detail (nanite). Both of these are groundbreaking achievements. But having had to install this in a bunch of university computers I can tell you that it comes at a cost.

Interestingly, the most significant issue is the space these installations require. We have optimized our installation as much as we can, but we nonetheless had to introduce systems whereby local storage was wiped clean every two weeks.

Re: The Gates of Argonath in VR at 50 FPS on Unreal Engine

#39

Post by [deleted] »

concordDance wrote: post #31
avian wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It will also lead to questions about the copyright of the resulting models I'm sure there will be no questions there. The questions about the copyright of models like DALL-E, Stable Diffusion, etc. exist solely because it infringes on the rights of thousands of random artists all around the world. There is no one single entity with enough power to clearly oppose it so people making the models can get away with "que…

> The questions about the copyright of models like DALL-E, Stable Diffusion, etc. exist solely because it infringes on the rights of thousands of random artists all around the world How does it infringe? Are your memories of a movie copyright infringement? https://youtu.be/IFe9wiDfb0E

[deleted]

Re: The Gates of Argonath in VR at 50 FPS on Unreal Engine

#40

Post by jffry »

contravariant wrote: post #6
djmips wrote: post #4

50 FPS is too low. There's a reason that 90 FPS is the low bar for VR.

For something this big and far away you'd think there would be a way to cheat. It's not as if things are going to move massively if you move your head a bit, you should be able to precalculate things to an extent.

There is such a way to cheat, and it's pretty clever. Store a depth map and just approximate parallax while you're waiting for a real new frame. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asynchronous_reprojection
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