Poll: What keyboard layout do you use? • Hacker News Board

Re: Poll: What keyboard layout do you use?

#21

Post by flixic » Wed, Dec 28, 2011, 1:24 AM UTC

stevenashley wrote: post #11

slowpoison wrote: post #4

If it weren't for vim, I would have definitely considered switching. I know you can map keys and all, but, it just doesn't make sense going through all the hassle. Are there any bi-layouters out there?

Qwerty and Colemak. I sometimes use Qwerty when I am chatting while gaming or when on someone else's computer - though about 2/3 as fast. I find that I don't have to actively think about what layout I am typing in, it just flows. I imagine bilinguists have a similar experience. I chose Colemak primarily because it doesn't mess with common shortcuts (Bottom-left keys "qwarzxcvbm" remain the the same positions).

Pretty much exactly the same for me.

I still can't use Colemak on iOS devices, so regular QWERTY encounters still happen, but I didn't lose much of my QWERTY speed after I switched, something I feared might happen.

Before Colemak I tried Dvorak for about a month, but uncomfortable locations of common shortcuts seemed bit unfriendly - great for typing, not as great for computer use.

Re: Poll: What keyboard layout do you use?

#22

Post by cytzol » Wed, Dec 28, 2011, 1:24 AM UTC

georgemcbay wrote: post #3

qwerty. If the alternate layouts do give any real speed advantages (which is open for debate, I've heard of studies proving both sides), it isn't enough to be non-standard, IMO. YMMV but it isn't uncommon for me to be typing at someone else's keyboard and I don't want to have to mentally switch modes, so I just stick with qwerty. Also, as much as some hackers like to focus on typing speed (advocating dvorak, the essa…

I switched to Dvorak two years ago, and though I'm a bit faster, it's not by much.

The benefit of Dvorak is comfort, rather than overall typing speed, and that's something that can't be easily measured. Most of the time, your hands stay on the home row, and I've noticed that the shorter travel distance for my fingers lets me type for longer periods of time without needing to take a break, instead of just typing faster.

I liken it to headphones - when you switch away from iPod headphones to an expensive audiophile pair, you don't notice a huge difference until you have to go back, and what you previously thought was fine now sounds horrible. I used to be fine with qwerty, but now whenever I use it I can't help but notice "wow, my hands are moving all over the place".

Re: Poll: What keyboard layout do you use?

#23

Post by guylhem » Wed, Dec 28, 2011, 1:24 AM UTC

QWERTY Canadian CSA ie with support for french and english and many other languages. Apple got it right. But PC sold in Quebec come with some awful mixup (multiple colors per key to support 2 optional layouts)

Is it just because doing what everybody does seems to the the thing to do in a PC construction business?

Can't be IPR because the work was done by parts of the goverment, and IIRC this still is the mandatory keyboard layouy for governmental sale

Re: Poll: What keyboard layout do you use?

#24

Post by thwest » Wed, Dec 28, 2011, 1:26 AM UTC

kbd wrote: post #14

There's a lot of "I type fast on qwerty so why would I bother switching?" Speed isn't even the main reason I use dvorak. The primary reason is that it's more comfortable to type in. In addition, as a programmer, a lot of the characters actually happen to be in more useful positions than in qwerty, even though that's not what the keyboard was designed for. '-_' especially is in a better place (home row, right pinky).…

I spent a year using dvorak and did notice a slight comfort increase. I've since reverted to qwerty due to device inertia. Currently the biggest interface ergonomics problem I am trying to get through is using the mouse less in windows

Re: Poll: What keyboard layout do you use?

#25

Post by jcromartie » Wed, Dec 28, 2011, 1:29 AM UTC

I tried Dvorak, and while I like the layout it's just not worth it. The number of exceptions that you have to make (certain apps, shortcut muscle memory, other devices, other peoples' systems, games, etc.) becomes a real problem very quickly.

If I only had to type on my own computer's keyboard and nothing else, I'd use Dvorak.

Re: Poll: What keyboard layout do you use?

#26

Post by hazov » Wed, Dec 28, 2011, 1:36 AM UTC

QWERTY with American keymap on my MacBook with support for dead keys and QWERTY with ABNT2 brazilian layout like this: http://oui.com.br/n/e107_files/images/teclado-abnt2.png

Re: Poll: What keyboard layout do you use?

#27

Post by warp » Wed, Dec 28, 2011, 1:50 AM UTC

cryptoz wrote: post #17

younata wrote: post #13

Dvorak user. I also use vim heavily (I switched to dvorak before I started using vim, so I've always been used to having h,j,k, and l being separated.

But doesn't that destroy some of the main good points about vim? Like keeping your fingers on the same spots on the keyboard? You could re-map hjkl to whatever the dvorak equivalents and then you'd probably have an easier time navigating around.

I use dvorak with vim, and having the hjkl keys in other locations has never been a problem for me. If you know vi well you probably don't even use them that much, as there are usually faster ways to move around (e.g. "b" and "w" to move around horizontally).

Re: Poll: What keyboard layout do you use?

#28

Post by patrickyeon » Wed, Dec 28, 2011, 1:53 AM UTC

Dvorak, mostly. Switched >10 years ago, but have nearly always been using qwerty keyboards at school or work, so I'm quite bilingual, as it were. Given the option, I'll take Dvorak, solely for comfort. Speed was about the same on both after a couple months of use, still is. I was on the Dvorak layout before I started using vim, but it doesn't bother me to use it as such.

Re: Poll: What keyboard layout do you use?

#29

Post by warp » Wed, Dec 28, 2011, 2:00 AM UTC

RKearney wrote: post #18

QWERTY, but only because I haven't yet had the time to purchase stickers or a Dvorak keyboard so I can learn Dvorak. It also doesn't help at all that the iPhone doesn't have a software Dvorak keyboard layout (jailbreaking is not an option).

IMO you shouldn't use stickers or a dvorak keyboard to learn a new layout, the goal is to touch-type, without looking at the keyboard. The F and J keys have ridges so you know where your index fingers should rest by just feeling the keys, and you should be able to find everything else from there without looking. Just print out a dvorak layout on paper and keep that around for a month or two.

Re: Poll: What keyboard layout do you use?

#30

Post by oreo » Wed, Dec 28, 2011, 2:11 AM UTC

Separate Qwerty sub-question: Why does every laptop mfr now put the Windows & Menu keys on the bottom row & Ins/Del on the top row? I use Ins/Del way more. And what genius put PgUp and arrow up on the same key, needing to use Fn? Overall, even if you are Qwerty, the mfrs do a lousy job at placing the rest of the keys well.