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The United States of America vs. Samuel Bankman-Fried Indictment [pdf]

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Re: The United States of America vs. Samuel Bankman-Fried Indictment [pdf]

#261

I'm curious what kind of plea deal Caroline Elison got.

When she gets 18 months to his 20 years, I think the two of them will be used in Goofus & Gallant-style comics in law school to demonstrate the importance of shutting up and letting your lawyer do the talking.

Re: The United States of America vs. Samuel Bankman-Fried Indictment [pdf]

#262
post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really don't get this either. The guy has got to have a whole legion of lawyers. How are they allowing him to still speak publicly? I'm not even important and I've been consoled by company lawyers to not talk about stuff just "just in case". Yet this guy is is involved in one of the most high profile cases of all time screaming from the mountaintops about it. This whole FTX thing is very suspicious on all kinds of…

He ignores the lawyers.

The strategy of ignoring advice from attorneys has "worked" for Trump and Musk. Welcome to the age of solipsistic anti-expertise, where cultivating your personal brand matters above all else. It seems like an inevitable condition of deep set post-reality. The interesting question is what develops next.

Re: The United States of America vs. Samuel Bankman-Fried Indictment [pdf]

#264
post #144

Is there some reason why this kind of stuff is typed up on a typwriter?

Various legal systems have standards for the form for which documents should be submitted to them which are surprisingly nitpicky in terms of items like fonts and spacing. Of course, these standards were created when typewriters were the dominant use case, so had deference to what typewriters could actually do. Even though most of the typewriter use has fallen out of fashion, the standards remain, with the results th…

Also it makes things more equal. Like appellant courts can tell only x number of pages. And for that sort of limit to make sense the line spacing, font size and margins need to be consistent. With only set of fonts allowed.

Courts really don't want to argue about how any submission is laid out and in best case they get to just throw out something looking wrong saving their time.

Re: The United States of America vs. Samuel Bankman-Fried Indictment [pdf]

#265

How anyone could look at this man's behavior over the last few weeks and not think he was on a fast track to a federal penitentiary is beyond me. A word to the unwise: If you have done something, anything, that you have a credible reason to believe the United States government thinks is illegal, shut up . Do not do any of the following: * Go on a podcast and talk about it * Go on a Twitter livestream and talk about i…

I generally agree with you, but if I had to steelman SBF's actions:

1. Prosecutors don't operate independently of the court of public opinion. They can throw the book at you (e.g. the George Floyd officers) or let you off easy (e.g. other officers who historically did similar things but did not face the same charges).

2. The current perception is that he committed fraud (like Madoff), and if convicted for that would likely go to prison for the rest of his life.

3. He's clearly not innocent of wrongdoing, and there's too many people involved who are cooperating with authorities, so just being quiet doesn't help him as much (in contrast to being found at a crime scene with no witnesses).

4. If he can get a conviction only of criminal negligence then perhaps he can get out of prison faster.

5. Thus perhaps if he can loudly admit to being a bumbling idiot and super negligent, it might sway the public opinion to criminal negligence instead of outright fraud.

Re: The United States of America vs. Samuel Bankman-Fried Indictment [pdf]

#266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Donald Trump did exactly the opposite of your advice at every turn, yet remains free and unindicted. SBF’s main mistake seems to have been not cultivating political clout before committing fraud, not anything related to what he said or did.

Trump's corporations are indicted and he's banned from running charities in New York. He was also impeached twice, which is the same thing as being indicted (and convicted too).

> He was also impeached twice, which is the same thing as being indicted (and convicted too).

The Senate trial is the equivalent of conviction; the House impeachment trial is more the equivalent of a grand jury indictment (although a very politicized one). No US President has ever been convicted in the Senate trial, Trump included.

Re: The United States of America vs. Samuel Bankman-Fried Indictment [pdf]

#267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do we have some examples of people who have amassed great real or perceived fortunes (and power) that have not become drunk on it? Musk on stage with Chapelle last night, Elizabeth Holmes, or SBF’s whole schtick, who are the ones who have kept their feet on the ground? What are the attributes of these others who don’t lose themselves in fawning attention and (sometimes short-lived) mountains of capital?

See some videos on YouTube of Warren Buffet and Charlie Munger conducting Berkshire's annual shareholder meetings. It will help.

Quick link to 2022: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=E_seuUbfUGw

Although I get the impression a large part of Buffet's normalcy is because he's chosen to spend his time making money for other people.

If you're ridiculously rich... you could do worse than thinking of common people as your boss, for perspective.

Re: The United States of America vs. Samuel Bankman-Fried Indictment [pdf]

#268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is silly. You think the career DOJ prosecutors are looking at the list of victims and only deciding to prosecute if there is a rich person on the list?

A lot of the things that defraud non-wealthy people (multi-level marketing, all of those "supplements" you can buy in the medicine isle, false advertising) aren't illegal or practical to sue over. Let's look at one particular example, the stop the steal scam. Thousands of people were tricked in to donating to the ringleaders of an impossible political cause based on false claims, and none of them are going to jail fo…

Didn’t Bannon et al. get indicted for a very similar scheme for some impossible border wall project? Seems like these things require patience

Re: The United States of America vs. Samuel Bankman-Fried Indictment [pdf]

#269
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Knowing how connected the guy is, I'm guessing he'll only serve a few years at most. I sincerely hope I'm mistaken.

Being extraordinarily connected did not help Madoff much: he was sentenced to 150 years in prison and died there last year.

Being extraordinarily connected did help Epstein though: he only spent one month in jail.

Re: The United States of America vs. Samuel Bankman-Fried Indictment [pdf]

#270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Judge people by their observed behaviors, not what you assume they should know. Lots of people should be smart and should act more intelligently than they do.

There are many accounts of SBF's capacity for subterfuge. I don't believe he was blabbing about what he did because he's stupid.

You can be a smart crook and still be stupid enough to do stupid things. Especially if you think you are smart enough to get away with it.
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