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Ask HN: Why are some YC startups not posting salary ranges when law requires it?

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Re: Ask HN: Why are some YC startups not posting salary ranges when law requires it?

#61

Post by Osiris »

paulgb wrote: post #53

There are some comments in here that verge on assuming bad faith on the part of the companies involved, so I think it's worth pointing out that this is a new law which has been in effect for just over a month. It's been on the way for a while, so it's not “sudden”, but it’s still a new thing that people are figuring out and it’s easier to forget about if you’re in the habit of re-using old listings. (Not about OP, wh…

This has been law in Colorado for 2 years and applies to anyone offering jobs to any Colorado resident including remote jobs.

The law passed in 2019 and went into effect Jan 1, 2021.

Re: Ask HN: Why are some YC startups not posting salary ranges when law requires it?

#62

Post by yamtaddle »

sampo wrote: post #44
eloff wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's alt data? I've never heard that term before.

"What Is Alternative Data and Why Is It Changing Finance?" https://builtin.com/fintech/alternative-data

TL;DR: Info gleaned from just about any source other than company statements and market data, used to guide investment choices. This includes stuff like satellite imagery, which has been used for a long time for these sorts of purposes, but also e.g. social media trends. I guess the news is that there's more of it happening now, because the practice itself isn't new.

Re: Ask HN: Why are some YC startups not posting salary ranges when law requires it?

#63

Post by shanebellone »

CoastalCoder wrote: post #45
JustSomeNobody wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not add it by default?

> Why not add it by default? IIUC, it's generally held that in a price negotiation, the first party that posts a number is at a disadvantage. Starting salary is one kind of price negotiation. So I can understand why employers would be reluctant to do that.

This is probably true but also bad practice imo. It instantly signals that employers value leverage rather than employees.

Re: Ask HN: Why are some YC startups not posting salary ranges when law requires it?

#64

Post by gregjor »

wpietri wrote: post #25
gregjor wrote: post #2

Probably because HN is not a law enforcement agency for New York City. The law has some exceptions, perhaps those apply. Why not contact the company and politely ask for the salary range?

> Probably because HN is not a law enforcement agency for New York City. True, but irrelevant, as that's not the only reason to do it. YC has a brand whose value they surely wish to maintain. Presumably that gives them an interest in not directly aiding companies in breaking the law.

Ethical behavior, to me, includes considering more than one reason someone or some company does something I don't like. Possibly these companies posting on HN deliberately intended to break the law. Equally possibly (more likely, in my opinion) those companies don't know about the law, or haven't had time to comply since the law went into effect just a few weeks ago. Any number of explanations present themselves, and only a few come down to "deliberately breaking the law" or doing anything unethical or shady.

So I don't think a reasonable person should quickly (and publicly) jump from "this job posting apparently for NYC doesn't include salaries" to "the company broke hiring laws" and "HN directly aids companies breaking the law." Try a more generous interpretation on.

Re: Ask HN: Why are some YC startups not posting salary ranges when law requires it?

#65

Post by ntonozzi »

Osiris wrote: post #61
paulgb wrote: post #53

There are some comments in here that verge on assuming bad faith on the part of the companies involved, so I think it's worth pointing out that this is a new law which has been in effect for just over a month. It's been on the way for a while, so it's not “sudden”, but it’s still a new thing that people are figuring out and it’s easier to forget about if you’re in the habit of re-using old listings. (Not about OP, wh…

This has been law in Colorado for 2 years and applies to anyone offering jobs to any Colorado resident including remote jobs. The law passed in 2019 and went into effect Jan 1, 2021.

And yet many job postings, even those that are only in Colorado, still don't have the salary on the job posting.

Re: Ask HN: Why are some YC startups not posting salary ranges when law requires it?

#66

Post by busterarm »

conanbatt wrote: post #56

The real question is why HN is filled with people that have values completely orthogonal to the VC space, like people wanting to leverage the law to make other people do things.

Because that's where culture is right now...

Nowadays if you're in a professional organization, for example if you're a lawyer, people will make professional complaints against you for your first amendment speech, irrespective of your professional practice. Essentially filing fraudulent complaints to silence you. And they do so as an organized political activity.

And sadly it's been hilariously effective so far.

Re: Ask HN: Why are some YC startups not posting salary ranges when law requires it?

#67

Post by bilsbie »

CoastalCoder wrote: post #45
JustSomeNobody wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not add it by default?

> Why not add it by default? IIUC, it's generally held that in a price negotiation, the first party that posts a number is at a disadvantage. Starting salary is one kind of price negotiation. So I can understand why employers would be reluctant to do that.

Wouldn’t the concept of anchoring say the opposite though?

I’ve always wondered that.

My guess is if you say too high of a number they don’t take you seriously so anchoring can’t work?

Re: Ask HN: Why are some YC startups not posting salary ranges when law requires it?

#69

Post by Osiris »

josefresco wrote: post #4

I found an example on today's front page (Rutter): https://jobs.ashbyhq.com/rutter/7b222f5f-cd46-4592-9cf8-6cd1... No salary range posted, job is in NYC.

NY is not the only state that requires jobs postings to include salary ranges.

Re: Ask HN: Why are some YC startups not posting salary ranges when law requires it?

#70

Post by googlryas »

Osiris wrote: post #61
paulgb wrote: post #53

There are some comments in here that verge on assuming bad faith on the part of the companies involved, so I think it's worth pointing out that this is a new law which has been in effect for just over a month. It's been on the way for a while, so it's not “sudden”, but it’s still a new thing that people are figuring out and it’s easier to forget about if you’re in the habit of re-using old listings. (Not about OP, wh…

This has been law in Colorado for 2 years and applies to anyone offering jobs to any Colorado resident including remote jobs. The law passed in 2019 and went into effect Jan 1, 2021.

I was just in a Walgreens near Boulder a few days ago and noticed that they were advertising for pharmacy assistants and didn't post their salary range, and also didn't list it even after I went to sign up online for the job. So I have to guess a lot of employers are disregarding the law. I was also disappointed when I found out there wasn't a particularly easy way to report the violation to the state. It could just be a webform that I fill out that takes 2 minutes, but there was so much overhead that I decided I didn't care enough to complete it.
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