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Ask HN: If I get locked out of everything, please try to help me

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Re: Ask HN: If I get locked out of everything, please try to help me

#51

Post by vbezhenar »

Wowfunhappy wrote: post #4

This is my nightmare. This is why I refuse to use 2FA. (Except on services that require it, and I wish they didn't require it.) Am I worried about getting hacked? Absolutely! But when I weigh the likelihood of (1) someone else getting into my account without 2FA and (2) locking myself out of my own account with 2FA, the latter seems much more likely! I understand how backup codes work. I promise you I will loose them…

It's simple. If you assume the real possibility of losing your digital account, then act like you'll lose it tomorrow. Adjust your life and move on. I don't care about digital accounts. I switch my main mail and phone every few years just for the sake of it. I avoid buying stuff bound to digital account. My accounts are disposable and have zero value other than nostalgic one.

I didn't lose a single account yet. I have printed backup codes, I have password manager, I have passwords backup in a text file on thumb drive, two copies. I have my domain held by registrar in my country, so I can just visit their office with my ID and talk with them. So I take some reasonable measures to protect myself. But I have no fear of losing those digital assets.

I actually gave a thought about protecting myself by creating a single 100% reliable email and then bind other accounts to that mail. Believe it or not: I didn't find any provider which would satisfy me. My worst case scenario: I'm going to jail for 20 years. Every free provider will delete my account after few years of inactivity. Paid providers usually are small enough so I wouldn't trust them anyway. My current plan is using my own domain with autopayment and enough balance on account. But of course that's not reliable. Registrar might just go bankrupt. And I can't really reserve my domain for 50 years no matter how much money would I pay.

Re: Ask HN: If I get locked out of everything, please try to help me

#52

Post by crooked-v »

jrochkind1 wrote: post #44
crooked-v wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As long as least one of those is still good, I should still be able to get in. Google has, in some cases, started requiring auth codes sent to specific devices , even if you're already using your own configured TOTP 2FA.

They expect that none of your devices will ever die? This makes no sense.

It makes plenty of sense to Google: engineer for the 98% use case and the remaining 2% should just go away and stop wasting their time.

Re: Ask HN: If I get locked out of everything, please try to help me

#53

Post by djbusby »

jrmg wrote: post #50

I have long wondered if two factor authentication actually causes more economic harm than it solves - it just doesn’t cause that harm to be noticeably all in one place (the harm is spread to millions of users who will lose access at some point during their lives rather than concentrated on the company that implements TFA dealing with fraud). It feels like it might. This isn’t counting the productivity that’s lost to…

This is the way of capitalism. Move costs outside your organization and call it profit.

It's why companies don't offer phone support. Or ones that do (like mine) get premium pricing.

Re: Ask HN: If I get locked out of everything, please try to help me

#54

Post by jrmg »

jrochkind1 wrote: post #43
jrmg wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> work laptop, my home laptop, and my phone There’s a fire or gas explosion or earthquake or something, and you need to leave all those behind. What do you do? > Oh, everyone else is just hoping they never lose their phone? Really? I would be very, very surprised if that’s not what the vast majority of the population is doing. Many people have a phone as their _only_ computing device, and no printer, and don’t really…

> What do you do? I get screwed! I guess the right answer is that I have the backup codes carefully preserved.... off site! In case of natural disaster. Every time I sign up for a new account, I print out the backup codes, and take them to an off-site secure storage location, which of course i have... somewhere. There's no way 90%+ of internet users are doing that. I'm not even going to pretend I have any chance of d…

Ah, I see we both have a more similar view than I thought!

I really should be storing some codes for my password manager somewhere…

Re: Ask HN: If I get locked out of everything, please try to help me

#56

Post by password4321 »

crooked-v wrote: post #6

There was a post a while back around poor and homeless people encountering exactly this problem on a regular basis. Lots of people in the comments were incredibly dismissive and sometimes actively malign about it. Edit: One suggestion from me would be to try and start the dead phone connected to power but with the battery physically removed (assuming it's removable). That might bypass whatever issue it's having and l…

Librarian's Letter to Google Security

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32304320

Re: Ask HN: If I get locked out of everything, please try to help me

#57

Post by phpisthebest »

donmcronald wrote: post #32
crooked-v wrote: post #6

There was a post a while back around poor and homeless people encountering exactly this problem on a regular basis. Lots of people in the comments were incredibly dismissive and sometimes actively malign about it. Edit: One suggestion from me would be to try and start the dead phone connected to power but with the battery physically removed (assuming it's removable). That might bypass whatever issue it's having and l…

> There was a post a while back around poor and homeless people encountering exactly this problem on a regular basis. Lots of people in the comments were incredibly dismissive and sometimes actively malign about it. Even worse than that, they're often connecting from public IPs that are "suspicious" which causes automated systems to treat them more harshly. In Canada it's gotten to the point where you need an interne…

In the US if you are under 135 percent of the Federal Poverty Level you qualify for a free Mobile Phone with internet service. I am surprised Canada does not have a program like that

Re: Ask HN: If I get locked out of everything, please try to help me

#58

Post by Jeremy1026 »

donmcronald wrote: post #32
crooked-v wrote: post #6

There was a post a while back around poor and homeless people encountering exactly this problem on a regular basis. Lots of people in the comments were incredibly dismissive and sometimes actively malign about it. Edit: One suggestion from me would be to try and start the dead phone connected to power but with the battery physically removed (assuming it's removable). That might bypass whatever issue it's having and l…

> There was a post a while back around poor and homeless people encountering exactly this problem on a regular basis. Lots of people in the comments were incredibly dismissive and sometimes actively malign about it. Even worse than that, they're often connecting from public IPs that are "suspicious" which causes automated systems to treat them more harshly. In Canada it's gotten to the point where you need an interne…

My local library actually lends out hotspots, unlimited data, no charge. Its an amazing service that would be amazing to see spread around to all libraries.

Re: Ask HN: If I get locked out of everything, please try to help me

#59

Post by charcircuit »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #11
Gigachad wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Problem is that support people mistakenly resetting account auth when the attacker calls up and social engineers them is a bigger and more common issue than people’s only device dying. Not to say that’s not a thing that happens, but it’s a smaller of the two problems.

It's a smaller of the two problems for the company . If you are really poor, losing access to your online life because you couldn't pay your phone bill or something can be a huge, huge problem. I have been homeless. I'm not currently. But this is an extremely stressful situation that could do all kinds of damage to my life if I can't get it sorted.

Losing access because someone stole your account is even worse because of how much access a Google account gives someone.

Re: Ask HN: If I get locked out of everything, please try to help me

#60

Post by cyral »

I had this happen with a cheapo android phone ages years ago, where the battery drained beyond 0% and the charging circuity wouldn't recognize it. Sent it for repairs and it conveniently came back with a dead battery again due to the long shipping time. I ended up stripping the wires out of the charger (the USB end, not 120v), and connecting it directly to the battery for 30 seconds or so. This bypasses the charging circuitry in the phone and got it up to a few % so that it would turn on. Surely this can go very wrong but it was my last idea.
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