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Is Dark Mode Good for Your Eyes? (2020)

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Re: Is Dark Mode Good for Your Eyes? (2020)

#291

Post by boomboomsubban »

IncRnd wrote: post #223
BossingAround wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My comment does not mention anecdotal evidence but a person using their eyes to perform an experiment. That is clearly not anecdotal. It is clearly anecdotal [1] at the very least to everyone else that reads your comment. It is also clearly insufficient to draw any scientifically valid conclusions. [1] https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/anecdotal%20evide...

> It is clearly anecdotal [1] at the very least to everyone else that reads your comment. It is also clearly insufficient to draw any scientifically valid conclusions. You are simply repeating something enough that you believe it to be true. You are misinformed about the meaning of the word anecdotal [1] and appear to be playing word games between "anecdotal", "anecdotal evidence", and a misunderstanding of what I wr…

Your own link starts with "Anecdotal evidence is evidence based only on personal observation." Even if you actually performed some experiment on yourself, unless you had some outside method of calculating eye strain it would still be anecdotal evidence.

Re: Is Dark Mode Good for Your Eyes? (2020)

#292

Post by causi »

KaiserPro wrote: post #270
alpos wrote: post #72

This post seems to boil down to, "I read a summary of one study, so I am confident in telling you all how wrong you are". Thanks but I'll let the scientific process play itself out over time. In the mean time, I appreciate that the public debate has induced phones, apps, and many web sites to give me the option to enjoy reading things all day without eye strain. The fact that more stuff defaults dark mode or follows…

Look, darkmode, and the bluelight fear is not really based on that much science. Yes, UV and top end blue does cause cataracts in people, but thats from the sun, not monitors. There are at least two strands to darkmode, one is the "It stops me from sleeping" and the other is eye strain. the sleeping part is almost certainly nothing to do with the colour temperature of the light coming out of your device. If you go ou…

The moon casts blue light.

Moonlight is not blue. In fact it is more red than sunlight.

https://i.stack.imgur.com/72dkh.png

https://i.stack.imgur.com/4wtWq.gif

Re: Is Dark Mode Good for Your Eyes? (2020)

#293

Post by laserlight »

kriro wrote: post #226
IncRnd wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My comment does not mention anecdotal evidence but a person using their eyes to perform an experiment. That is clearly not anecdotal. It is ridiculous for people with eyes to not use their own eyes except to read studies as to whether their own eyes prefer light or dark. That should be obvious.

The problem with this approach is that it is biased towards short term effects at the cost of long term effects and when you realize this it's too late already. "Feels better" is obviously a very good heuristic and usually what's good short term is probably more likely to be good than bad long term and millions of people rely on this heuristic but it's good to be aware of the shortcomings of this approach.

Came here to say the same. A good example is low-quality sunglasses that don't block UV light. Pupils dilate when wearing sunglasses, because there's less light coming in. Dilated pupils let more UV light in compared to naked eye vision. Subjective experience might be relief, yet it's at the cost of long-term retinal health.

Re: Is Dark Mode Good for Your Eyes? (2020)

#294

Post by TeMPOraL »

GIFtheory wrote: post #126
hosteur wrote: post #2

I primarily use dark mode when I am in the dark or in a dimly lit room. Having any light blasted right into my eyes hurts. And ruins my night vision. And also messes with my sleep.

Agreed—the article is sort of silly in that it debunks a bunch of bogus claims about dark mode, but then completely overlooks the main legitimate use, which is to limit exposure to artificial light at night. You basically want to get as much light during the day as is safely possible to stay focused and alert (note that this can be counterindicated for people with certain health conditions, like glaucoma), and then l…

> You basically want to get as much light during the day as is safely possible to stay focused and alert (note that this can be counterindicated for people with certain health conditions, like glaucoma)

Incidentally, for most people, this means that - unless they're spending most of their time outdoors - they're not getting enough light.

Re: Is Dark Mode Good for Your Eyes? (2020)

#295

Post by scatters »

midoridensha wrote: post #174
deepspace wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is interesting how different people have different experiences. I grew up in the days of green monochrome terminals and monitors, and hated them. I bought an amber monitor as soon as they became available, and that helped a bit with the eyestrain. Windows 3, Word for Windows and TSE were a godsend to me. Finally, I could read and write code and documents the way I thought they were intended to be viewed- dark text…

>Finally, I could read and write code and documents the way I thought they were intended to be viewed- dark text on a light background, mimicking real-world books and papers. Real-world paper doesn't have a backlight behind it, projecting bright white light directly into your eyes. If you want to see documents the way they were "intended" to be viewed, you need to use an e-ink screen.

Why should your eyes care whether the light was generated behind the screen or bounced off it? Photons are photons.

Re: Is Dark Mode Good for Your Eyes? (2020)

#296

Post by bregma »

MPSimmons wrote: post #274
KaiserPro wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look, darkmode, and the bluelight fear is not really based on that much science. Yes, UV and top end blue does cause cataracts in people, but thats from the sun, not monitors. There are at least two strands to darkmode, one is the "It stops me from sleeping" and the other is eye strain. the sleeping part is almost certainly nothing to do with the colour temperature of the light coming out of your device. If you go ou…

The moon wasn't the predominant source of light at night for most pre-industrial people. Fire was, and is what we evolved with, which is likely why red light doesn't cause your eyes to constrict ( https://thehikingauthority.com/red-light-night-vision-a-myth... )

I would hesitate to believe that crowds sitting around a bright fire at night will produce more viable offspring than those fumbling in the dark away from the light.

The evolutionary mechanism for selecting blue-sensitive rod cells in our retinas along with red-sensitive cone cells must surely be unrelated to the sodium emission spectrum, given that so may other mammals have similar retinas but lack fire-making skills.

Re: Is Dark Mode Good for Your Eyes? (2020)

#297

Post by wheels »

ycombinete wrote: post #285
wheels wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm interested in your light setup, particularly if you happen to use high-CRI bulbs. It also took me ages to realize how large of an effect SAD had on me. I grew up in Texas, where it wasn't much of a thing, but went to college in Michigan and then moved to Germany (where I've been for 20 years) and it took me multiple years to notice the pattern of only struggling with what I'd previously dubbed "burn out" in the w…

I've had this issue. I have 5 1350 lumen bulbs in my office, but they are all 80 on the Color Rendering Index, and it's somehow bright and dull in here simultaneously. I think the sandblasted white chandelier covers make it worse as well.

CRI80 bulbs just grate on me. Even some of the ones rated 90 I find a little annoying (which I've occasionally had to settle for for e.g. downlights in a particular depth). And some of mine that I've bought that are rated 95+, I'm skeptical of.

I'm too pedantic / OCD-ish to deal with the colors being so off. If you're the sort of person that's bugged by that sort of thing, just bite the bullet and get the better bulbs. If you've still got old indansecents around, try them out in that fixture. If you feel like it restores sanity, then high CRI LEDs will too.

I wish I could say, "They'll last you 10 years", but my experience with LEDs has been that I feel like they literally die as often as my old incandescents, but because I use so many lights in my home, I'm happy for the power savings.

Re: Is Dark Mode Good for Your Eyes? (2020)

#298

Post by jwarden »

causi wrote: post #292
KaiserPro wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look, darkmode, and the bluelight fear is not really based on that much science. Yes, UV and top end blue does cause cataracts in people, but thats from the sun, not monitors. There are at least two strands to darkmode, one is the "It stops me from sleeping" and the other is eye strain. the sleeping part is almost certainly nothing to do with the colour temperature of the light coming out of your device. If you go ou…

The moon casts blue light. Moonlight is not blue. In fact it is more red than sunlight. https://i.stack.imgur.com/72dkh.png https://i.stack.imgur.com/4wtWq.gif

Thanks, this was new information for me. I always noticed how moonlight on snow looks blueish. But per the Wikipedia article on moonlight[1], this is apparently an illusion:

The color of moonlight, particularly around full moon, appears bluish to the human eye compared to other, brighter light sources due to the Purkinje effect. The blue or silver appearance of the light is an illusion.

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moonlight

Re: Is Dark Mode Good for Your Eyes? (2020)

#300

Post by VLM »

As with most "medical" discussions online, something like being "good for your body part" rapidly turns into anything other than scientific medical evidence. Much like how its impossible to discuss something like diet scientifically online.

The fad aspect should not be overlooked. Originally, "light mode" GUIs on CRTs was something of a fools errand because most CRTs are somewhat non-linear so light mode emphasized waviness and interference patterns and outright astigmatism. Occasionally "light mode" was a bragging point that your hardware could handle it and your GUI was designed to cooperate with the limited hardware of the day (think original 80s 90s apples). Around the turn of the century "light mode" became a financial status symbol that you can afford a "perfect" LCD display, so only the coolest people used light mode. Now, 2010 is too old to be stylish so obviously the opposite of light mode is "dark mode" and that is the pinnacle of style because it proves you're using something designed or redesigned post 2015 or so. Just the usual conspicuous consumption oneupsmanship.

Another aspect rarely mentioned is distraction / ADD / working conditions. Obviously dark mode on a glossy screen provides something of a perfect mirror to see your surroundings which is usually distracting to normal people in normal conditions. For those with ADD or easily distracted in a tightly packed open office its practically an ADA issue to force them to use dark mode. If I must have a glossy screen I find it vastly less distracting to use light mode. Turn up the brightness so its not the brightest thing in the room but its brighter than the endlessly moving reflections on the screen and light mode looks pretty good.

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