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Video games made in the USSR (2020)

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141–150 of 210 posts

Re: Video games made in the USSR (2020)

#141
post #13

Compare what happened to the creators of these games with the creators of popular titles in the USA and Japan. Tetris is an especially interesting one; Tetris was a worldwide phenomenon, a huge hit in the US that sold a huge number of copies. The creators of Tetris saw none of the profits from their creation. Their game was seized by the state as soon as it became popular and they never really profited. Compare to si…

There's no way we have space here to do the whole debate, but for starters, the Soviet Union wasn't communist by any reasonable definition. Wikipedia does a quick breakdown: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communism#Associated_usage_and... > While the term Communist state is used by Western historians, political scientists, and news media to refer to countries ruled by Communist parties, these states themselves did not…

The most common definition of a communist country is a country that is run by communists. Communists are members of the Communist party, usually the only party in the country. A communist country is not usually meant to mean a country that achieved communism.

Similarly, casual phrases like "life under communism", which are used by the populace in communist countries themselves, mean "life when communists are/were in control". Since no country achieved communism there's usually no reason to disambiguate.

Re: Video games made in the USSR (2020)

#142
post #137
post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At the individual level, the boundaries are really blurry. I'm a Russian. I know many Ukrainians. Often, when you meet a Ukrainian, you'll never know that they are, in fact, from Ukraine, unless you ask. Sometimes their pronunciation ("г" as "h" instead of "g") would give them away, but other than that, there are practically zero differences — especially cultural ones. We really are mostly the same people and we shou…

Is there any good source on the topic of "г" pronounced as "h" instead of "g"? I've studied Russian as a second language and once got into an argument over whether Russian has the equivalent of "h" because "x" is pronounced as "kh", which is harder than "h". Does this phenomenon have some name, as googling didn't turn out much?

You're looking for fricative /ɣ/ in southern dialect. Relevant links:

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%D0%B3%D1%8D%D0%BA%D0%B0%D0%B...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Russian_dialects

https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9D%D0%B0%D1%80%D0%B5%D1%87...

Re: Video games made in the USSR (2020)

#143
post #137
post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At the individual level, the boundaries are really blurry. I'm a Russian. I know many Ukrainians. Often, when you meet a Ukrainian, you'll never know that they are, in fact, from Ukraine, unless you ask. Sometimes their pronunciation ("г" as "h" instead of "g") would give them away, but other than that, there are practically zero differences — especially cultural ones. We really are mostly the same people and we shou…

Is there any good source on the topic of "г" pronounced as "h" instead of "g"? I've studied Russian as a second language and once got into an argument over whether Russian has the equivalent of "h" because "x" is pronounced as "kh", which is harder than "h". Does this phenomenon have some name, as googling didn't turn out much?

It's hard to describe in writing, but I'll try. There's no "h" sound, like the one where you just exhale, neither in Russian nor Ukrainian. The Russian "г" is hard, like "g" in "get". The Ukrainian equivalent to that is "ґ", but their "г" is something in between, closer to "kh". The fact that many English-language reports about the war do transliterate "г" as "h" in Ukrainian toponyms doesn't help, but it's as close as one could reasonably get to the real Ukrainian pronunciation.

There's so much no such sound that I've seen Hebrew and Arabic transcribed into Russian with the character "h" for that sound.

> Does this phenomenon have some name, as googling didn't turn out much?

Certainly not a formal one. Хэканье? Or maybe simply украинский акцент?

Re: Video games made in the USSR (2020)

#144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no way we have space here to do the whole debate, but for starters, the Soviet Union wasn't communist by any reasonable definition. Wikipedia does a quick breakdown: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communism#Associated_usage_and... > While the term Communist state is used by Western historians, political scientists, and news media to refer to countries ruled by Communist parties, these states themselves did not…

The most common definition of a communist country is a country that is run by communists. Communists are members of the Communist party, usually the only party in the country. A communist country is not usually meant to mean a country that achieved communism. Similarly, casual phrases like "life under communism", which are used by the populace in communist countries themselves, mean "life when communists are/were in…

I understand where you're coming from, but there is a very strong reason to disambiguate, for leftist theorists: plenty of us still want to strive for a communist society, which we view as the best way to organize ourselves.

It's perfectly understandable that one of the mechanisms used against this philosophical and political ideology is the modification of language to win rhetorical battles, but... we're going to push back lol.

Let's try this and see if you can relate: America is actually a socialist country. Between farm, airline, and oil and gas subsidies, oligopolies defended by regulation, and the seizing of the assets of society for the bailing out of banks, the American economic system is a far cry from capitalism. All the innovations that came from this economic system called American socialism we can attribute to this firm socialist organization of production and consumption. America is successful and a good place to live, more countries should strive for socialism.

Surely you see how frustrating this would be? Thus how many leftists feel when we argue for concepts we like about communism as it has actually been defined for centuries vs the rhetorical twisting done through necessity by Stalinists, Maoists, and McCarthyists (all in different directions, mind you). It becomes much harder for us to have conversations about the actual merits and values of a given system.

To whit: how can we describe a society that's achieved our goals of communism, if we use the same word to describe a society that's the opposite of our goals? Ignoring tankies for a second who have lost themselves in the sauce and pretend that the Soviet Union wasn't plagued by famine or that somehow the PRC is a socialist paradise despite the fact that they still pay for healthcare, can you see how difficult it is when I say "I want the shared resources of society to be leveraged to provide for people's basic needs, and for workers to be empowered to enjoy the full fruits of their own production, I want communism," and for two different people to say "You want communism? So you want (repeats definition of fascism)" or "You want communism? You want (repeats definition of capitalism)".

I get tired of words losing their meaning. If living int he PRC is "living under communism," what shall we call a system with common ownership of the means of production (the State, made of unelected officials, owns much of the industry in the PRC, but, some of it is privately owned by billionaires), no private property (the PRC has this in many ways, especially when owned by corporations), no social classes (the PRC has massive income divide and insurmountable socio-economic classes and poverty traps like much of the modern world), no money (the PRC runs plenty of international banks, and the basic needs of citizens are still paid in cash), and no State (need I explain the power of the State in the PRC)? Because that's what communism is, so I have no idea how to even have a conversation when the word is made to mean something else entirely.

Say it can't be achieved, say it's unrealistic, say it can only be achieved if xyz horrible thing happens, that's totally fine, that's an interesting conversation to have, but we can't have that conversation if we can't even settle terms.

Re: Video games made in the USSR (2020)

#145

Because of the war against Ukraine, I’ve become more aware of Ukraine’s role in the USSR when reading up on history. One thing I’ve noticed is just how much of the most impressive technological feats came from Ukraine.

For me, the surprising part was learning how many Russian people I know have parents or grandparents who were born in Ukraine. I knew that Soviet Ukraine had ~50 million people. Almost 20% of the USSR, and a bit less than France, Italy, or the UK at the time. I knew that Ukraine was one of the most developed and densely populated parts of the USSR, and of the Russian Empire before that. I had some idea how the border…

My mother is Russian. My father is Ukrainian. I never saw any difference between those cultures other than Ukrainian language being a funny version of Russian. I never had any issue communicating with Ukrainian people and then didn't have issues understanding me either.

I don't believe there's ANY difference between Russians and Ukrainians. To me it's the one nation and that's about it. Ukrainian-Russian war is a civil war fueled by the West, it's not the first civil war in this world and won't be the last I guess.

Re: Video games made in the USSR (2020)

#146
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The association "USSR = Russians" is part of the systematic attempt by the soviet regime at cultural (and sometimes literal) genocide. The 90th anniversary of the Holodomor was just two weeks ago.

But, through amazing coincidence, all the bad things the Russian Empire/USSR did were done by Russians while everything good by Ukrainians. It was some kind of magic. E.g. invasions in Czechoslovakia, Poland, Afghanistan - 100% Russians, not a single Ukrainian, even Brezhnev was Russian. Russian mathematicians? 100% Ukrainians, even Euler. Pushkin? He is the grand-grand-father of Bendera himself. Chikatilo? He is act…

> Russian mathematicians? 100% Ukrainians

It's not true. For example: Andrey Kolmogorov (Soviet Union) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrey_Kolmogorov

Nikolai Lobachevsky (Russian Empire) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikolai_Lobachevsky

Ivan Vinogradov (Russian Empire, USSR) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivan_Vinogradov

And many others.

Do not spread propaganda. Be objective, please.

Re: Video games made in the USSR (2020)

#147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Holodomor was not genocide. Communists were internationalists and judged people based on their social class, not nationality. Many areas of the USSR, including in Russia proper, did experience precisely the same level of suffering and death from hunger. Also, food requisitions in Ukraine which led to Holodomor were organised and conducted by native Ukrainians. It is easy to look up that most senior party and NKVD pos…

You are stating some of the objections to the argument of whether Holodomor constitutes a genocide, (minus the "there were ukranians in senior party positions," this seems a weak new argument to me, especially considering group 13: there absolutely were Jewish people working with the Gestapo), however I agree with Raphael Lemkin, who coined the term "genocide," and believes the famine was planned by Stalin because he…

> there absolutely were Jewish people working with the Gestapo

Name one Jew on a senior leadership (~Gauleiter level) position in Nazi Germany. There were certainly tons of Ukrainians occupying positions on all levels of power in USSR. Hell, Ukrainian nationals held top position in the USSR far longer than Russians did. Imagine Nazi Germany headed by a Jew?

As for Wikipedia article, at this age the question is very political and Wikipedia reflects that. Some Ukraians want the first place in this victimhood olympics, and the current political situation favours them in the current political landscape, so they can bend history interpretation to their interests. But you know what, if we use very specific words like "fascism" or "genocide" to name different things we don't like, these words will eventually lose their meaning and become generic insults.

Was Holodomor a tragedy? Sure. Was it a genocide - a targeted systemic effort to kill people of one specific nation - not even close.

Btw, I too could take part in this victimhood olympics if I wanted: my grandparents have fled the Voronezh area (near the Volga river) in 1947 because of extreme famine [0] that killed a lot of people. Note the wording in English version:

"Regions that were especially affected included the Ukrainian SSR with 300,000 dead, and the Moldavian SSR with 100,000 dead. Other parts of the Soviet Union such as the Russian SFSR and the Byelorussian SSR were also affected with 500,000 deaths." - so "especially affected" areas lost fewer people than Russian SFSR which was "also" affected. Unfortunately, these tragedies that were a result of a Soviet rule are viewed through nationalistic lens today, and are being used in propaganda pieces.

[0]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_famine_of_1946%E2%80%...

Re: Video games made in the USSR (2020)

#148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For me, the surprising part was learning how many Russian people I know have parents or grandparents who were born in Ukraine. I knew that Soviet Ukraine had ~50 million people. Almost 20% of the USSR, and a bit less than France, Italy, or the UK at the time. I knew that Ukraine was one of the most developed and densely populated parts of the USSR, and of the Russian Empire before that. I had some idea how the border…

My mother is Russian. My father is Ukrainian. I never saw any difference between those cultures other than Ukrainian language being a funny version of Russian. I never had any issue communicating with Ukrainian people and then didn't have issues understanding me either. I don't believe there's ANY difference between Russians and Ukrainians. To me it's the one nation and that's about it. Ukrainian-Russian war is a civ…

I am Ukranian and I am strongly disagree with you. First of all don't call Ukranian language funny version of Russian. Second "civil war" - is the war between citizen in the same country. Now answer on 2 questions: - who crossed the border of independed country? - where is the war going on?

Yes, there are of course a lot of similarities between Ukranians and people in Russia, as there are between Ukranian and Polish people or between Polish people and people in Check Republic.

Re: Video games made in the USSR (2020)

#149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But, through amazing coincidence, all the bad things the Russian Empire/USSR did were done by Russians while everything good by Ukrainians. It was some kind of magic. E.g. invasions in Czechoslovakia, Poland, Afghanistan - 100% Russians, not a single Ukrainian, even Brezhnev was Russian. Russian mathematicians? 100% Ukrainians, even Euler. Pushkin? He is the grand-grand-father of Bendera himself. Chikatilo? He is act…

> Russian mathematicians? 100% Ukrainians It's not true. For example: Andrey Kolmogorov (Soviet Union) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrey_Kolmogorov Nikolai Lobachevsky (Russian Empire) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikolai_Lobachevsky Ivan Vinogradov (Russian Empire, USSR) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivan_Vinogradov And many others. Do not spread propaganda. Be objective, please.

He's been sarcastic: "through amazing coincidence"

Re: Video games made in the USSR (2020)

#150
post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any good source on the topic of "г" pronounced as "h" instead of "g"? I've studied Russian as a second language and once got into an argument over whether Russian has the equivalent of "h" because "x" is pronounced as "kh", which is harder than "h". Does this phenomenon have some name, as googling didn't turn out much?

It's hard to describe in writing, but I'll try. There's no "h" sound, like the one where you just exhale, neither in Russian nor Ukrainian. The Russian "г" is hard, like "g" in "get". The Ukrainian equivalent to that is "ґ", but their "г" is something in between , closer to "kh". The fact that many English-language reports about the war do transliterate "г" as "h" in Ukrainian toponyms doesn't help, but it's as close…

The Ukrainian г is a voiced glottal fricative, IPA /ɦ/. This is as the English /h/ sound but voiced. Southern Russian dialects use /ɣ/, a voiced velar fricative, which is pronounced like /ɦ/ but further forward in the throat. East Slavic dialects turn Proto-Slavic /ɡ/ more into /ɦ/ the further south you go.
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