Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Airlines lobbying FAA to have only one pilot in the cockpit

cbsnews.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 267 posts

Re: Airlines lobbying FAA to have only one pilot in the cockpit

#41

Post by daigoba66 »

teeray wrote: post #16

Since we’re going to be talking about automation quite a bit here, I found Sully’s take on automation in the cockpit to be quite relevant: > “I’VE COME across a number of people over the years who think that modern airplanes, with all their technology and automation, can almost fly themselves. That’s simply not true. Automation can lower the workload in some cases. But in other situations, using automation when it is…

There’s a great classic pilot training video that covers this topic too: https://safeblog.org/2016/01/14/automation-dependency-childr...

It’s really great info for a lot of professions, not just aviation.

Re: Airlines lobbying FAA to have only one pilot in the cockpit

#42

Post by [deleted] »

teeray wrote: post #16

Since we’re going to be talking about automation quite a bit here, I found Sully’s take on automation in the cockpit to be quite relevant: > “I’VE COME across a number of people over the years who think that modern airplanes, with all their technology and automation, can almost fly themselves. That’s simply not true. Automation can lower the workload in some cases. But in other situations, using automation when it is…

[deleted]

Re: Airlines lobbying FAA to have only one pilot in the cockpit

#43

Post by willnonya »

fasthands9 wrote: post #6

> Prior to 2010, pilots needed just 250 hours to start flying for a commercial airline. The Airline Safety and Federal Aviation Administration Extension Act of 2010 raised this requirement from 250 hours to 1,500 hours. >co-pilots in foreign countries are required to have just 240 hours, with some of those hours occurring in a simulator. This is from a different article but feel like this is lower hanging fruit than…

This is the source of the current shortage. It is much more time consuming and expensive just to become a commercial pilot now. This has completely disrupted the progression and training in the pipeline and will not be alleviated by halving the pilot requirements.

When this flight hour change runs head first into a large number of pilots retiring the entire industry is going to be in a state of emergency.

Re: Airlines lobbying FAA to have only one pilot in the cockpit

#45

Post by [deleted] »

defrost wrote: post #29
polar8 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The other pilot is working from home.

For the sake of the discussion this isn't an entirely ridiculous notion. Here in W.Australia Rio Tinto manage and remote co-pilot otherwise fully automated 100 tonne Haulpak dump trucks (that can easily run over and crush a car or pickup truck) from 1,000 km away. I'm fully in favour of a human pilot and a co-pilot (an advanced trainee even) for short haul flights that don't require shift work for the pilot (eg: long…

[deleted]

Re: Airlines lobbying FAA to have only one pilot in the cockpit

#46

Post by jfengel »

gandalfgreybeer wrote: post #20
version_five wrote: post #8

I'm generally anti-union, but happy to see the union here pushing back against this. This is definitely not in passengers' interests, and normally passengers don't have an advocate with any power, so it's nice to see our interests are aligned with the pilots' union.

Idk if this is an American/West thing but here unions are the main reasons why workers are not exploited and have rights.

Same here in America. It's just that in America we resent that people with rights cost more, so every mistake any union has ever made must be proof that they want to resurrect Stalin and make him President for Life.

Re: Airlines lobbying FAA to have only one pilot in the cockpit

#47

Post by Retric »

defrost wrote: post #29
polar8 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The other pilot is working from home.

For the sake of the discussion this isn't an entirely ridiculous notion. Here in W.Australia Rio Tinto manage and remote co-pilot otherwise fully automated 100 tonne Haulpak dump trucks (that can easily run over and crush a car or pickup truck) from 1,000 km away. I'm fully in favour of a human pilot and a co-pilot (an advanced trainee even) for short haul flights that don't require shift work for the pilot (eg: long…

Yea, I think remote backup drivers for self driving cars is fairly reasonable, but remote pilots just brings to mind thousands of passenger filled bombs.

Re: Airlines lobbying FAA to have only one pilot in the cockpit

#48

Post by askvictor »

daguava wrote: post #24

Flight law and procedure is painstakingly written in blood, and the thorough analysis of every plane crash is why aviation is so incredibly safe, there is no possible way this would ever be allowed. I highly recommend checking youtube for crash analysis videos and series btw, the incredible detail these investigations go into is eye opening, and really gave me an appreciation for the field.

Perhaps the CEOs (in constant pursuit of profits and bonuses) don't care so much about safety, and are trying to make a play to get society to accept a lower level of safety in air transport? We accept huge amounts of deaths from road transport, preventable illnesses, etc. Air transport is possibly the exception (that is getting in the way of profits)

Re: Airlines lobbying FAA to have only one pilot in the cockpit

#49

Post by maximilianroos »

> But many recent examples tend to confirm the unions' argument, including a 2015 crash in Europe. A co-pilot of a Germanwings flight locked the pilot out of the cockpit and deliberately crashed the plane, killing himself and 149 other people, giving credence to the ongoing argument that in an airborne crisis you need two pilots working in concert to save the aircraft

How does that support the argument that two pilots are necessary?

It supports the argument that a determined pilot is going to crash the airplane whether or not there are one or two pilots on the plane!

Re: Airlines lobbying FAA to have only one pilot in the cockpit

#50

Post by John23832 »

maximilianroos wrote: post #49

> But many recent examples tend to confirm the unions' argument, including a 2015 crash in Europe. A co-pilot of a Germanwings flight locked the pilot out of the cockpit and deliberately crashed the plane, killing himself and 149 other people, giving credence to the ongoing argument that in an airborne crisis you need two pilots working in concert to save the aircraft How does that support the argument that two pilot…

Because now (at least in America), there are always two bodies in the cockpit at all times. When one of the pilots goes to the bathroom, the head stewardess goes into the cockpit. Someone can always attempt to unlock.
Post reply on HN