Haha wow, like 30% more passengers who are 3+ hours late than are on time (11k 3+ hours late vs. 8k on time). That's impressively bad. In aggregate, 4x as many passengers late as on time.
Amtrak asks fed regulators to investigate Union Pacific handling of Sunset Ltd
31–40 of 128 posts
Re: Amtrak asks fed regulators to investigate Union Pacific handling of Sunset Ltd
#32Earlier quoted context omitted.
Its long and complicated. Amtrak exists in the first place because once upon a time these freight operators were also the passenger operators. While today they look like "extracting rent", once upon a time they were forced by regulation to carry the burden of passenger service. The situation with Amtrak was basically the government agreeing to take over that before it killed the companies, but Amtrak would retain cer…
This is all important context, and I thank you for including it. I agree it's not as clear cut as "public versus private." But there's a recurring theme here: public money enabling private growth, followed by public money softening private decline. Railroads are just one instantiation of this pattern: it shows up in agriculture, industrial manufacturing, medical and materials research, &c. At some point, it should ma…
We have an answer to that question. The answer is "Conrail" and "Amtrak". You can fairly argue that those were both very half-assed attempts to socialize the services, and were honestly both expected to fail from the start, but you can't say it hasn't been tried. The results were neither a failure nor a panacea. There is something more than a simple primary driving force like private/public interest needed to explain whats going on.
Re: Amtrak asks fed regulators to investigate Union Pacific handling of Sunset Ltd
#33Earlier quoted context omitted.
You say "nationalize" awfully glibly. Private enterprise, on private land, not bankrupt. Nationalizing that isn't an easy thing to do in the US.
Socioeconomic business logic is up for constant debate, as is when unconventional implementations are warranted. I don’t believe I used it in so much a glib fashion, but more matter of fact. It is a tool, and it can be used.
Currently the US trades dollars for real goods. One of the major uses of those dollars, since we don't export nearly enough goods to run balanced trade, is to buy US assets. Do you think that maybe our trade partners will stop accepting those dollars if we start nationalizing companies? At that point, doesn't it seem like maybe the USD will crumble?
Re: Amtrak asks fed regulators to investigate Union Pacific handling of Sunset Ltd
#34As a frequent Amtrak passenger, I can attest to the unpunctuality of the Union Pacific and other freight operators. On several occasions we have been delayed by a passing freight train that was an hour or more behind schedule, causing us to miss our scheduled connection. During one such occasion, while traveling on the Coast Starlight from Eugene this summer, I was treated very rudely by the conductor, who kicked me…
The real problem here is that freight trains have so much priority in the US, unlike every other major country in the world. It doesn't matter how many or what kinds of trains we have. This sort of policy will always makes trains an unreliable and therefore impractical mode of transportation. And this is a major reason for the US leading the world in carbon consumption per capita.
They only have de facto priority; officially passenger trains are supposed to be prioritized. This is in fact the basis of the complaint described in the article.
Re: Amtrak asks fed regulators to investigate Union Pacific handling of Sunset Ltd
#35Earlier quoted context omitted.
Alternatively, nationalize the rail lines and make UP pay for access. Privatization of critical infrastructure, historically, leads to poor outcomes with profits getting siphoned off in the process. Rail workers aren’t getting sick days and trains are longer (leading to delays) because of investors squeezing rail infra and those who operate it. Why allow it to continue? The whole “privatizing profits socializing loss…
You say "nationalize" awfully glibly. Private enterprise, on private land, not bankrupt. Nationalizing that isn't an easy thing to do in the US.
> Government support, most especially the detailing of officers from the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers – the nation's only repository of civil engineering expertise – was crucial in assisting private enterprise in building nearly all the country's railroads. Army Engineer officers surveyed and selected routes, planned, designed, and constructed rights-of-way, track, and structures, and introduced the Army's system of reports and accountability to the railroad companies. More than one in ten of the 1,058 graduates from the U.S. Military Academy at West Point between 1802 and 1866 became corporate presidents, chief engineers, treasurers, superintendents and general managers of railroad companies. Among the Army officers who thus assisted the building and managing of the first American railroads were Stephen Harriman Long, George Washington Whistler, and Herman Haupt.
> State governments granted charters that created the business corporation and gave a limited right of eminent domain, allowing the railroad to buy needed land, even if the owner objected.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_transportation_in_the_Uni...
Re: Amtrak asks fed regulators to investigate Union Pacific handling of Sunset Ltd
#36Earlier quoted context omitted.
Socioeconomic business logic is up for constant debate, as is when unconventional implementations are warranted. I don’t believe I used it in so much a glib fashion, but more matter of fact. It is a tool, and it can be used.
Currently the US trades dollars for real goods. One of the major uses of those dollars, since we don't export nearly enough goods to run balanced trade, is to buy US assets. Do you think that maybe our trade partners will stop accepting those dollars if we start nationalizing companies? At that point, doesn't it seem like maybe the USD will crumble?
Nah, never happens. Where will they go? The yuan? The euro? The ruble? Dysfunctional emerging markets? Being a global reserve currency is as, if not more powerful than, a DoD branch. Lot of capital available to burn, pun intended. Investors still invest in Greece and Italy, for example, and they’ve done far worse economically speaking.
Important to keep in mind this exposure is graded on a curve. You don’t have to be the fastest when the bear is chasing you, just faster than your slowest friend.
Re: Amtrak asks fed regulators to investigate Union Pacific handling of Sunset Ltd
#37Earlier quoted context omitted.
Socioeconomic business logic is up for constant debate, as is when unconventional implementations are warranted. I don’t believe I used it in so much a glib fashion, but more matter of fact. It is a tool, and it can be used.
Currently the US trades dollars for real goods. One of the major uses of those dollars, since we don't export nearly enough goods to run balanced trade, is to buy US assets. Do you think that maybe our trade partners will stop accepting those dollars if we start nationalizing companies? At that point, doesn't it seem like maybe the USD will crumble?
You should make a case for this, rather than asking other people to make a case against it. We flooded the world with dollars after 2008 and still couldn't manage to get our inflation over 2% until a year or two ago.
Re: Amtrak asks fed regulators to investigate Union Pacific handling of Sunset Ltd
#38The history of the US's Western freight lines is fascinating (and frustrating): we've allowed these massive companies (UP, BNSF) to extract rent for well over a century, in exchange for having laid down the original lines (which, mind you, were also paid for in land and bonds[1]). [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pacific_Railroad_Acts
We should look at nationalizing the rail lines and then investing in them to accommodate freight and passenger traffic more effectively. Positive Train Control[1] and judicious expansion of switches/bypass lanes should allow us to better saturate the rails so that throughput is maximized.
This could even enable new passenger services other than Amtrak to operate in competition.
Re: Amtrak asks fed regulators to investigate Union Pacific handling of Sunset Ltd
#39Earlier quoted context omitted.
The real problem here is that freight trains have so much priority in the US, unlike every other major country in the world. It doesn't matter how many or what kinds of trains we have. This sort of policy will always makes trains an unreliable and therefore impractical mode of transportation. And this is a major reason for the US leading the world in carbon consumption per capita.
Nit: I couldn’t find a source that indicated the US leads in carbon consumption per capita, although it is near the top. For instance: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/consumption-co2-per-capit... More to the point, as several other comments noted the official policy is to prioritize passenger rail, which clearly wasn’t happening, so hopefully events such as these will begin to change that.
>the official policy is to prioritize passenger rail
Define "official"
>hopefully events such as these will begin to change that.
What events?
If you think this was a rare case, you obviously don't ride Amtrak long distance much. Most interstate Amtrak trips get delayed by freight, and it has been that way for decades.
Re: Amtrak asks fed regulators to investigate Union Pacific handling of Sunset Ltd
#40Earlier quoted context omitted.
The real problem here is that freight trains have so much priority in the US, unlike every other major country in the world. It doesn't matter how many or what kinds of trains we have. This sort of policy will always makes trains an unreliable and therefore impractical mode of transportation. And this is a major reason for the US leading the world in carbon consumption per capita.
They only have de facto priority; officially passenger trains are supposed to be prioritized. This is in fact the basis of the complaint described in the article.
That is just plain wrong. In practice, of the 30+ interstate Amtrak trips I've taken in the past 10 years, the overwhelming majority of them are delayed by freight rail. It is standard operating procedure.