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Open Letter to sites with annoying interfaces

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Re: Open Letter to sites with annoying interfaces

#71

Post by muxxa »

stephth wrote: post #44
dvdhsu wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know anything about design. The solution that I propose seems obvious though; am I missing something? > Too many elements are a distraction. > What is the affordance of invisibility? There is a middle though: instead of either making it invisible OR cluttered, couldn't you just design it with a small clue, such as an arrow, which would open a drop-down menu when rolled over (on a computer) or tapped on (on a…

couldn't you just design it with a small clue, such as an arrow, which would open a drop-down menu when rolled over (on a computer) or tapped on (on a touch device)? I really, really like this idea as a solution to fix possible hidden rollovers usability issues. Like the best ideas it sounds obvious once you hear it. If it is well executed (I would imagine something clean and simple yet recognizable like a point with…

Also, sometimes you really need some text beside your indicator arrow. On the native email app on the iPad, my Dad repeatedly cannot figure out how to reply to an email (despite it being the principle thing he wants to do), because the icon (a curved arrow) lies among 3 other icons of equal obscurity (to him).

Another compromise solution is to put text on the page, but to grey it out, or otherwise make it less visually distinctive according to it's lack of importance.

Re: Open Letter to sites with annoying interfaces

#72

Post by skore »

latchkey wrote: post #10

I agree! Here is another semi-close example. Not about hovering, but how about needless hiding of important user experience? https://github.com/mozilla/browserid/issues/797 I filed this super minor issue in the browserid issue tracker and it was closed with 'as designed'. No feedback as to why it was designed this way, but it sure seems silly to me to hide the 'remove' button under an 'edit' button. I can understand…

Wow, that's just silly. I agree - "Delete" is simply not a subset of "Edit"ing an option in a configuration. It may be a subset of editing the entire configuration, but having a two-step process that makes a non-connected action into a child action is mind boggling. People need to learn their CRUD/BREAD better.

Re: Open Letter to sites with annoying interfaces

#73

Post by latchkey »

skore wrote: post #72
latchkey wrote: post #10

I agree! Here is another semi-close example. Not about hovering, but how about needless hiding of important user experience? https://github.com/mozilla/browserid/issues/797 I filed this super minor issue in the browserid issue tracker and it was closed with 'as designed'. No feedback as to why it was designed this way, but it sure seems silly to me to hide the 'remove' button under an 'edit' button. I can understand…

Wow, that's just silly. I agree - "Delete" is simply not a subset of "Edit"ing an option in a configuration. It may be a subset of editing the entire configuration, but having a two-step process that makes a non-connected action into a child action is mind boggling. People need to learn their CRUD/BREAD better.

Interesting that you write 'Edit' vs. 'edit'...

Here is another issue I just filed last night:

https://github.com/mozilla/browserid/issues/809

tl;dr: Super minor, but the case of buttons is actually important UX too.

I'm worried about BrowserID UX because we are implementing it on our site as an additional login system along with Facebook Connect. I'd love to see BrowserID become successful since we need an alternative to Facebook and OpenID is a train wreck. But, I worry that with bad UX, it will remain just an unused interesting idea.

Re: Open Letter to sites with annoying interfaces

#74

Post by kstenerud »

dhx wrote: post #36
droithomme wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your understanding of the term affordance, as inferred from your usage of it, is not the standard use. You use it as if it means the reason for something. Affordance is a clue something gives regarding its use. Doors with handles are pulled, with plates are pushed. Just seeing the interface component intrinsically describes its use. This is not possible for invisible components, therefore they have no affordance at a…

the user is not going to intuit that the function must be invisible because he can't see it User intuition changes over time as familiarity with new interfaces is gained. A system whereby edit/action buttons appear only when the mouse is on the right hand side of the screen seems reasonable -- if users have trained themselves to expect this behaviour and UIs consistently use this pattern in predictable ways. If every…

Those are specific positions on a screen in a desktop OS UI. That's HUGELY different from yet-another-webapp, because you only need to learn it ONCE, and then it remains the same always, no matter what app you're using or what page you're viewing.

With web pages and apps, it's up to each designer to decide where and how things are laid out, and everyone has their own opinion, so if 20 designers decide to hide their components, how is the user to find them? The last thing I want to do is play hide-and-seek moving the mouse around a webpage/app randomly in the forlorn hope that maybe one of the gadgets or magic locations will pop up a control that I can use.

Put in a gear icon that I can mouse over. Put SOMETHING there that says "hey! I can be interacted with!" Otherwise I'll just ascribe the interface as designed by someone incompetent and look for an alternative.

Re: Open Letter to sites with annoying interfaces

#76

Post by skore »

latchkey wrote: post #73
skore wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, that's just silly. I agree - "Delete" is simply not a subset of "Edit"ing an option in a configuration. It may be a subset of editing the entire configuration, but having a two-step process that makes a non-connected action into a child action is mind boggling. People need to learn their CRUD/BREAD better.

Interesting that you write 'Edit' vs. 'edit'... Here is another issue I just filed last night: https://github.com/mozilla/browserid/issues/809 tl;dr: Super minor, but the case of buttons is actually important UX too. I'm worried about BrowserID UX because we are implementing it on our site as an additional login system along with Facebook Connect. I'd love to see BrowserID become successful since we need an alternati…

Yeah, but I'm probably just used to it and since I was referring to BREAD, it kind of made sense. I guess it's one of those age old questions like "do we say 'your' or 'my'?".

Re: Open Letter to sites with annoying interfaces

#77

Post by gtirloni »

stephth wrote: post #18
droithomme wrote: post #4

Thanks so much for this article. Hidden interface elements that only appear when hovering over a secret spot like it's some kind of easter egg is one of the most frustrating things I have seen. It's not really user interface design so much as it is user interface abject failure and total ignorance of how interfaces work . I refuse to call anything so dysfunctional design! This has been sneaking into desktop applicati…

My work involves designing interfaces and this discussion could help me understand this topic better; but like the author of the article, your post shows some intense frustration towards rollover-only elements, but none made it very evident to me as to why it's so frustrating and why it's so "stupid". We all experience things differently, and I'd love to picture a perspective where it's so frustrating. Here's how I s…

Are you in the GNOME 3 "design" team by any chance?

Re: Open Letter to sites with annoying interfaces

#78

Post by gtirloni »

dhx wrote: post #36
droithomme wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your understanding of the term affordance, as inferred from your usage of it, is not the standard use. You use it as if it means the reason for something. Affordance is a clue something gives regarding its use. Doors with handles are pulled, with plates are pushed. Just seeing the interface component intrinsically describes its use. This is not possible for invisible components, therefore they have no affordance at a…

the user is not going to intuit that the function must be invisible because he can't see it User intuition changes over time as familiarity with new interfaces is gained. A system whereby edit/action buttons appear only when the mouse is on the right hand side of the screen seems reasonable -- if users have trained themselves to expect this behaviour and UIs consistently use this pattern in predictable ways. If every…

The use of "GNOME 3" and "a good example" in the same phrase has been banned by the International Association of Common Sense.

Re: Open Letter to sites with annoying interfaces

#79

Post by gefh »

stephth wrote: post #18
droithomme wrote: post #4

Thanks so much for this article. Hidden interface elements that only appear when hovering over a secret spot like it's some kind of easter egg is one of the most frustrating things I have seen. It's not really user interface design so much as it is user interface abject failure and total ignorance of how interfaces work . I refuse to call anything so dysfunctional design! This has been sneaking into desktop applicati…

My work involves designing interfaces and this discussion could help me understand this topic better; but like the author of the article, your post shows some intense frustration towards rollover-only elements, but none made it very evident to me as to why it's so frustrating and why it's so "stupid". We all experience things differently, and I'd love to picture a perspective where it's so frustrating. Here's how I s…

Late answer here, but that's not the delete contact button. That's in a row of buttons above the contact (in a more... dropdown, to be precise). This button just blanks the name, and is kind of a shortcut alternative to ctrl-a delete.
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