EU-wide maximum limit of €10K for cash payments • Hacker News Board

Re: EU-wide maximum limit of €10K for cash payments

#361

Post by mcv » Sat, Dec 10, 2022, 10:49 PM UTC

roenxi wrote: post #184

mcv wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They want privacy for regular people, accountability for the rich and powerful.

That is a lot like asking for a form of secure end-to-end encryption which law enforcement can monitor server-side. If a government can differentiate between a regular person and someone rich and powerful, neither of them have any privacy. There has to be invasive monitoring of the regular person to ensure they aren't stealthily becoming rich.

I don't see how it is. This isn't about differentiating between rich and poor, nor about monitoring people becoming rich. It's about making sure that the kind of transaction that no normal person would ever do in cash, cannot be done in cash. It targets rich crooks not by identifying them, but by targeting the kind of transaction that only they would ever do.

Re: EU-wide maximum limit of €10K for cash payments

#362

Post by lzaaz » Sat, Dec 10, 2022, 10:50 PM UTC

bigfudge wrote: post #350

lzaaz wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's right, I don't. Good thing about cars and houses is that you can pay some amount officially and then pay more money under the table.

Right. But that is illegal and in my view also immoral. If you want to change the law campaign for it. But breaking tax laws is not a victimless crime. You are freeloading/stealing from the rest of us.

It's impossible to make people vote to give themselves less money.

Re: EU-wide maximum limit of €10K for cash payments

#363

Post by olivermarks » Sat, Dec 10, 2022, 10:50 PM UTC

CosmicShadow wrote: post #351

jesusofnazarath wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A car?

I'm still not sure who buys a car that expensive with cash, seems sketchy, inconvenient and unsafe. I wouldn't take cash if someone wanted to pay me that much, in fact someone did, they paid me for a contract with $5000 in used 20s and it was really fucked up, I didn't know how to get it into a bank or use it for anything without setting off alarms.

Cash is king. If you are buying a non running classic car and have a tow vehicle and trailer ready you can drive a hard bargain in the moment.

Suggesting laborious bureaucratic transactions over several days removes this common occurrence in that world, along with at many other gatherings of specialists - antiques, pedigree animals, whatever

Re: EU-wide maximum limit of €10K for cash payments

#364

Post by wara23arish » Sat, Dec 10, 2022, 10:50 PM UTC

woodruffw wrote: post #177

vl wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Underreported info is that during many months of pandemic you couldn’t withdraw any significant amounts of cash. I decided to withdraw $10k just in case and they told me maximum they can do is $1k per day and this story repeated for many months.

I saw plenty of reporting on this, and nearly all of it was editorialized: it was being treated as evidence that customer savings weren't available, when the actual reason is that bank branches simply don't keep massive vaults of money on hand. If you have a bank account, you can always withdraw your savings (at least up to the amount insured, in the event of a bank collapse). But there has never been a guarantee tha…

I used to work for a bank in the US as a teller before 2019.

You absolutely can walk in and ask for 12K in cash. That amount is normal.

If you’re asking for 30-50K then coordination is needed, and its not because money is not available, simply because youd need to open the vault and that takes time.

Re: EU-wide maximum limit of €10K for cash payments

#365

Post by isodev » Sat, Dec 10, 2022, 10:50 PM UTC

AHappyCamper wrote: post #225

This is obviously the first part of a major push to force us to use Central Bank Digital Currencies. Now that they are banning cash, we will be controlled like never before. This is the beginning of the end of freedom.

I think you are jumping the gun on freedom here.

There are very few remaining instances in the region where people still pay large sums in cash. Transaction costs are so low (and mostly nonexistent) that cash remains in use either in very specialised circumstances or as part of “grey economy” activities.

Re: EU-wide maximum limit of €10K for cash payments

#366

Post by sgjohnson » Sat, Dec 10, 2022, 10:51 PM UTC

mrtksn wrote: post #352

sgjohnson wrote: post #337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my country cash payments over €8k were already banned, but it’s a largely unenforced law.

And how is that EU’s fault and what makes you think that your politicians were loving the large cash payments but Germany and France made them ban >10K EUR payments? Which country again?

Latvia

Re: EU-wide maximum limit of €10K for cash payments

#367

Post by grishka » Sat, Dec 10, 2022, 10:51 PM UTC

Teandw wrote: post #237

grishka wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But that implies that you're using the bank system in the first place. What if you don't?

If you're moving that much money around at some point that money has to flow into a legally operated financial provider/service for you to use it for any good means. You could launder $100k through the means you mentioned with Bitcoin through illegally operated exchanges for example but then what? You can't use it to buy a property that way.

> You can't use it to buy a property that way.

Do people in other parts of the world use bank transfers to buy property or what? I'm genuinely curious. Where I'm from it's often a cash transaction, unless it's a mortgage.

Re: EU-wide maximum limit of €10K for cash payments

#368

Post by wcoenen » Sat, Dec 10, 2022, 10:51 PM UTC

rmasters wrote: post #310

reachableceo wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the atm or the teller ? ATM limit of 1k is common. My small local credit union keeps about 10k in each of the tellers drawers . So you should be able to easily go up to 50k cash withdrawal . If it’s a large multinational , 100k I suspect. Also why not just go 10 days in a row and pull out 1k?

> Also why not just go 10 days in a row and pull out 1k? In the US, this could be considered "structuring" to avoid reporting requirements which is a federal crime with a sentence of up to 5 years in prison.

If the reason to pull out 1K/day is a 1K/day limit imposed by the bank, then the reason is obviously not to avoid reporting requirements and therefore it cannot be considered structuring.

Re: EU-wide maximum limit of €10K for cash payments

#369

Post by Symbiote » Sat, Dec 10, 2022, 10:51 PM UTC

flandish wrote: post #298

mfuzzey wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Stop pretending the government (any) has the “average” man’s best interest "Average" people don't pay >10k€ in cash. So this measure won't hurt average people and may stop some money launderers / frauders so no issue with it. And actually most EU countries already have lower limits.

You’re kidding, right? Average people buy cars with cash: a teen saving from first jobs for a first used car… eventually, “10k” will be where “teen” used cars land … and boom, average person. A person with a down payment on a house. …I can go on. The point is this: casting this wide a net in the name of “fighting terrorists” is absolute nonsense, and not worth what would happen to a terrorist in this net: a few extra…

Average Europeans use bank transfers or debit cards to make these payments.

Re: EU-wide maximum limit of €10K for cash payments

#370

Post by woodruffw » Sat, Dec 10, 2022, 10:52 PM UTC

omginternets wrote: post #301

Spivak wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And 99% of the time people do that is because they’re moving banks and they leave with a cashiers check instead of cash.

So, to be clear, you can’t actually liquidate your account.

You can always liquidate your account. What you can't do is make it some random branch's problem in a spur-of-the-moment decision; you have to plan it with them.