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We and Mozilla are working together to make the web awesome

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Re: We and Mozilla are working together to make the web awesome

#71

Post by magicalist »

azakai wrote: post #66
tomjen3 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that sarcasm? Native client is one of the best things that will ever happen to the web since jQuery made it possible to write cross-browser javascript. Imagine how much easier it will be in the future when ever very intensive programs can be written, and run, on the web.

Native Client only works on x86 and x86_64. You can't run Native Client content on your ARM phone or your PowerPC game console. That is very bad for the web, the whole idea of which is that you can access it from anywhere, using anything. There is some work to try to make it portable, but it is unclear how it will end up (how portable, how fast, how secure, etc.). Partly because of this, NaCl is not standardized or e…

I agree that NaCl isn't the road forward, but I definitely don't agree that support for it is an indicator of good values.

In your original comment, were you referring to the fact that Opera also runs on money from deals with search providers, yet doesn't support proposals from them if they disagree?

Re: We and Mozilla are working together to make the web awesome

#72

Post by azakai »

magicalist wrote: post #71
azakai wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Native Client only works on x86 and x86_64. You can't run Native Client content on your ARM phone or your PowerPC game console. That is very bad for the web, the whole idea of which is that you can access it from anywhere, using anything. There is some work to try to make it portable, but it is unclear how it will end up (how portable, how fast, how secure, etc.). Partly because of this, NaCl is not standardized or e…

I agree that NaCl isn't the road forward, but I definitely don't agree that support for it is an indicator of good values. In your original comment, were you referring to the fact that Opera also runs on money from deals with search providers, yet doesn't support proposals from them if they disagree?

Opera is funded by search deals, but I think I read that they make most of their money from carriers in return for installing Opera Mobile on phones. Not 100% sure though.

In any case, Opera has always been one of the biggest supporters of the open web, through working on standards, opposing things that are bad for the web, etc.

Re: We and Mozilla are working together to make the web awesome

#73

Post by mvgoogler »

azakai wrote: post #66
tomjen3 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that sarcasm? Native client is one of the best things that will ever happen to the web since jQuery made it possible to write cross-browser javascript. Imagine how much easier it will be in the future when ever very intensive programs can be written, and run, on the web.

Native Client only works on x86 and x86_64. You can't run Native Client content on your ARM phone or your PowerPC game console. That is very bad for the web, the whole idea of which is that you can access it from anywhere, using anything. There is some work to try to make it portable, but it is unclear how it will end up (how portable, how fast, how secure, etc.). Partly because of this, NaCl is not standardized or e…

"Native Client only works on x86 and x86_64. You can't run Native Client content on your ARM phone"

Not true: http://www.chromium.org/nativeclient/reference/arm-overview

Re: We and Mozilla are working together to make the web awesome

#74

Post by mvgoogler »

bzbarsky wrote: post #64
tomjen3 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that sarcasm? Native client is one of the best things that will ever happen to the web since jQuery made it possible to write cross-browser javascript. Imagine how much easier it will be in the future when ever very intensive programs can be written, and run, on the web.

Native client would lock the web into particular hardware platforms. So it is in fact one of the worst things that could happen to the web.

How would NaCl lock the web into a particular hardware platform?

NaCl run on x86-32, ARM and x86-64.

Re: We and Mozilla are working together to make the web awesome

#75

Post by Dylan16807 »

justincormack wrote: post #63
cpeterso wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Old Android browser versions are going to become the "IE6" of this decode.

It is easy to just use firefox on android though. Could push people to that.

If you have an armv7 chip, sure. But apparently nobody is motivated to fix the alignment bugs and make it work on older chips.

Re: We and Mozilla are working together to make the web awesome

#76

Post by bzbarsky »

mvgoogler wrote: post #74
bzbarsky wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Native client would lock the web into particular hardware platforms. So it is in fact one of the worst things that could happen to the web.

How would NaCl lock the web into a particular hardware platform? NaCl run on x86-32, ARM and x86-64.

Yes. Which means it does NOT run on PPC, or MIPS, or IA-32, or Sparc. Note that there are modern-ish web browsers available for at least PPC, MIPS, and Sparc.

More importantly, content using NaCl would not run on any new hardware platforms that might appear.

So if the web were to use NaCl to an appreciable extent, new platforms would be unable to get any traction in any context that relied on the web. We'd be stuck with ARM or X86 forever for any mobile devices we might have.

Maybe you think that's ok; I think that's a terrible idea; an attitude like that toward the web in the late 1990s would have meant that ARM phones that appeared in the late 2000s would not have been able to browse the web!

(Also, note that I said "hardware _platforms_", not what you asked above.)

Re: We and Mozilla are working together to make the web awesome

#77

Post by zobzu »

mvgoogler wrote: post #73
azakai wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Native Client only works on x86 and x86_64. You can't run Native Client content on your ARM phone or your PowerPC game console. That is very bad for the web, the whole idea of which is that you can access it from anywhere, using anything. There is some work to try to make it portable, but it is unclear how it will end up (how portable, how fast, how secure, etc.). Partly because of this, NaCl is not standardized or e…

"Native Client only works on x86 and x86_64. You can't run Native Client content on your ARM phone" Not true: http://www.chromium.org/nativeclient/reference/arm-overview

You need to make it work for it. It's not a very good analogy because parts are portable, but good enough for me: I can recompile my C program for arm. Doesn't make the x86 binary run.

Re: We and Mozilla are working together to make the web awesome

#78

Post by JS_startup »

powertower wrote: post #34

Some people would have a hard time surviving in the real world outside of Google's walls. I can see why a guy on the Chrome UI team would dismiss a valid business strategy of hedging against the IE + Firefox user-base that uses the search bar and address bar for 100% of their searches (vs. going to http://www.google.com directly) ... having their default search engine switched on them. To him, owning a share of the b…

My thoughts exactly. Paradoxically, being closer to the issue and company actually clouds your perception instead of enhancing it.

Re: We and Mozilla are working together to make the web awesome

#79

Post by zobzu »

DanBC wrote: post #59

> * "It's very simple: the primary goal of Chrome is to make the web advance as much and as quickly as possible."* This is actually a bit frustrating. There's a bunch of people writing sub-optimal web-pages; not understanding the features or the security; and then there's a bunch of browser engineers trying to keep up. Security still needs huge amounts of research and energy to progress beyond the broken model (usern…

I'd note that browserid (browserid.org) solves the "single social login for everything". It also solves the "user and pass everywhere" in fact. It's pretty damn neat.

Unfortunately i'm not sure people will adopt it. It's only good for the user. It doesn't bring money.

Re: We and Mozilla are working together to make the web awesome

#80

Post by zobzu »

ippisl wrote: post #60
drhowarddrfine wrote: post #5

Google has said from the beginning that the purpose of Chrome was to move the web forward, not compete with other browsers, and I had forgotten that.

Actions speak louder than words. Brendan Eich, Mozilla's CTO , which has some authority around issues concerning the open web , think Native client and Dart are bad for the open web[1]. Also one small way to improve the search experience, is easy search in multiple search engines. Firefox's search box is one way of doing so, But it has been removed in chrome. Does it really improve the web ? Does limiting the power o…

about the google sites speed its mostly all SPDY. It's hack but it's a good one. Thus it's in Firefox Aurora. Enable with about:config look for stuff called spdy, til its on by default
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