PFC bans are going to change waterproof garments • Hacker News Board

Re: PFC bans are going to change waterproof garments

#261

Post by mtreis86 » Sun, Dec 04, 2022, 11:00 PM UTC

reissbaker wrote: post #199

christophilus wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What brand of pans do you recommend?

Lodge is reasonably good and cheap for both cast iron and carbon steel — they're a bit less pretty than the higher-end stuff because they have the pebbly look of unsanded steel, but in practice it doesn't make a huge difference for cooking. Solidteknics pre-seasoned pans are amazing, but pricier, and are a nice hybrid between cast iron and carbon steel (and they're smooth, like vintage cast iron / carbon steel). In g…

Yeah, agree on both fronts, carbon steel is wonderful.

I wanted to add, regarding cast iron, you can always sand the pan down a bit to smooth out the surface.

On of the biggest benefits to iron or steel cookwear is that you can easily remove and re-apply the non-stick coating. Lodge has the directions on their website. Just make sure you buy pans that have oven safe handles as you bake them repeatedly with a thin layer of oil to build up the seasoning.

Re: PFC bans are going to change waterproof garments

#262

Post by justin66 » Sun, Dec 04, 2022, 11:03 PM UTC

senderista wrote: post #230

Not sure if use of recycled materials is responsible, but I bought a new Patagonia R1 fleece pullover a few years ago and it was utter garbage compared to its 20-year old predecessor (technically, same model). Probably the worst-fitting item of clothing I own, and the fabric is incredibly uncomfortable. Meanwhile, chest zipper on the original has gone out, but it fits as well and is just as comfy as the day I bought…

The design of the R1 hoody has pretty conspicuously changed as Patagonia’s customer base has shifted away from climbers and hikers and towards the fashion conscious with disposable income.

Regarding the fit, though, their sizing more generally might also have deliberately changed. I’d expect a “large” to be bigger in some places, for example, than it was twenty or thirty years ago, for the obvious reason.

I doubt that recycled materials play a role.

Re: PFC bans are going to change waterproof garments

#263

Post by berjin » Sun, Dec 04, 2022, 11:09 PM UTC

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #116

blindriver wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I ditched them a while ago as well. I only use cast iron or stainless steel and it makes me wonder why I ever bothered with non-stick before.

> I only use cast iron or stainless steel and it makes me wonder why I ever bothered with non-stick before. Because they are incredibly useful when it comes to certain kinds of food, especially eggs and fish. I find all the "self-congratulatory" posts on the topic of non-stick pans, and demonization of people that use them, of the "thou doth protest too much" quality. Tons of renowned chefs, like Jacques Pepin, have…

I cook scrambled eggs in a stainless pan with a decent amount of butter (about 20% butter). It's actually pretty easy to clean. Soak the pan in water for five minutes and use a steel wool brush and everything comes off easily. Many people recommend seasoning pans by overheating polyunsaturated fats; screw that it also creates a bunch of bad chemicals. Your number one concern should be health, then taste second. Chefs' obviously have different priorities so don't care what they have to say. Most restaurants produce unhealthy food containing a lot of sugar, processed oils and sodium but that tastes good as that's what customers demand.

Re: PFC bans are going to change waterproof garments

#264

Post by blindriver » Sun, Dec 04, 2022, 11:10 PM UTC

version_five wrote: post #181

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I only use cast iron or stainless steel and it makes me wonder why I ever bothered with non-stick before. Because they are incredibly useful when it comes to certain kinds of food, especially eggs and fish. I find all the "self-congratulatory" posts on the topic of non-stick pans, and demonization of people that use them, of the "thou doth protest too much" quality. Tons of renowned chefs, like Jacques Pepin, have…

I threw out all our nonstick stuff after I observed the coating routinely coming off into food. The exception is for eggs, we have a dedicated pan we only use for them, and although I've just read the other comments here about how easy it is to fry an egg in other pans, I find it goes much better in nonstick. And only frying eggs + using a plastic spatula seems to pretty much eliminate any wear on the coating.

I use butter with either my cast iron or stainless steel frying pans, and my eggs turn out better than they ever did on non-stick. I think simply using butter or olive oil makes cooking easier but also more flavorful.

Re: PFC bans are going to change waterproof garments

#265

Post by topaz0 » Sun, Dec 04, 2022, 11:11 PM UTC

wolverine876 wrote: post #164

bushbaba wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because in the early 2000s there was a war on natural fats. Nutritionists declared all fat bad. We now know that to not be the case. Your stainless steel, high carbon steel, and cast iron pans require using a small amount of oil/butter to have nonstick cooking properties.

> in the early 2000s there was a war on natural fats. Nutritionists declared all fat bad. We now know that to not be the case. Saturated fats were and remain to be generally thought unhealthy (if we say things like 'all' or 'always', we're almost certainly spreading misinformation; the world doesn't work that way). Other fats (polyunsaturates and monounsaturates) are believed to be healthy or neutral. There is ongoin…

"A war on all fats" is a pretty good summary of a lot of popular nutritional messaging in the '90s though. Low fat or fat free was a big selling point on lots of food packaging, even when it didn't make sense. Magazine articles about how you could cut just a bit more fat out of this or that recipe. I'm 100% in agreement that the reality is more nuanced, including that dietary fats, some more than others, can be harmful to health when consumed in excess. In other words, that it's not just the other extreme from that 90s consensus. I think the GP would agree too (the only hyperbole in their post was a statement attributed to nutritionists of the time). But the war on fat was real, and had a big presence in the culture.

Re: PFC bans are going to change waterproof garments

#266

Post by blindriver » Sun, Dec 04, 2022, 11:12 PM UTC

bradlys wrote: post #165

akira2501 wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> especially eggs Cooking eggs on a stainless pain isn't particularly difficult, you just need to change your technique and use quite a bit more preheating along with more oil or butter than you traditionally would for a non-stick pan. So, it's useful in that sense, but it's not as if we wanted for pan fried eggs before non-stick existed.

> along with more oil or butter than you traditionally would for a non-stick pan Which means you're trading one health benefit for another.

The low-fat diet myth was dispelled years ago by more rigorous scientific studies. I grew up for decades thinking butter led to heart attacks but that was a criminally bad pseudoscience that people accepted as fact for almost the entire duration of my life, and it makes me angry that I got fooled for so long.

Re: PFC bans are going to change waterproof garments

#267

Post by meindnoch » Sun, Dec 04, 2022, 11:12 PM UTC

burnished wrote: post #132

meindnoch wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>10^12 kg of water That's exactly 1 km^3 of water. The Earth has 1,386,000,000 km^3 of surface water. I don't think increasing the amount of water by ~0.00000007% would be noticeable.

It would probably mess up any km^2 of inhabited landmass.

Sure. And a glass of water can kill you if it goes in your lungs.

But stick to the charitable interpretation, where the water is distributed evenly in the environment, shall we?

Re: PFC bans are going to change waterproof garments

#268

Post by blindriver » Sun, Dec 04, 2022, 11:13 PM UTC

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #186

harimau777 wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is the difficulty with fish and eggs? I ask because I used to use eggs to deglaze my cast iron skillet. Cook something and then when I'm done cook scrambled eggs in it to soak up all the debris. As a plus side the eggs have the flavor of whatever you're cooking. (To be clear, I'm really interested in what the issue is. This isn't meant to be asking a question as a form of sarcasm.)

There are many egg preparation methods, e.g. a French omelette or over-easy or sunny-side up, where a non-stick surface (and here I mean either a non-stick pan like Teflon or a well-seasoned traditional pan) is essential. Using scrambled eggs to deglaze an iron skillet definitely isn't one of these methods.

It's absolutely not essential for over-easy or sunny-side up (I don't know what a French omelette is). I just use butter or olive oil, and they turn out better now than they ever did without burning or sticking.

Re: PFC bans are going to change waterproof garments

#269

Post by blindriver » Sun, Dec 04, 2022, 11:14 PM UTC

bushbaba wrote: post #87

blindriver wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I ditched them a while ago as well. I only use cast iron or stainless steel and it makes me wonder why I ever bothered with non-stick before.

Because in the early 2000s there was a war on natural fats. Nutritionists declared all fat bad. We now know that to not be the case. Your stainless steel, high carbon steel, and cast iron pans require using a small amount of oil/butter to have nonstick cooking properties.

You hit the nail on the head. Yes, now that you bring it up, it was this low-fat disinformation that caused all these unintended consequences.

Re: PFC bans are going to change waterproof garments

#270

Post by blindriver » Sun, Dec 04, 2022, 11:18 PM UTC

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #182

blindriver wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I ditched them a while ago as well. I only use cast iron or stainless steel and it makes me wonder why I ever bothered with non-stick before.

Do you know the chemical composition of your pan’s seasoning? There are a decent number of carcinogenic compounds (for example acrylamide) produced just by heating natural foods.

I don't season my frying pans at all. I hand-scrub it clean with SOS pads every time. I don't believe in seasoning the pans and just use butter or olive oil every time. I'm not a Michelin star chef, so to me it doesn't matter, but for example my kids really love my pork chops that I make on the $20 cast iron Lodge pan, so that's good enough for me!