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Brave launches private search ads

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Re: Brave launches private search ads

#111

Post by kevinventullo »

Archipelagia wrote: post #41

Not the biggest fan of Brave myself, but they seem to actually get extra points in my eyes for adding the paid option. It's not like you can pay $3 to Google to get them to stop surveilling you. On a bigger note, monetizing search without ads seem to be a pretty tricky business model. Especially if you want to move beyond being a niche product; even an average HN reader would be hard to convince to pay for a regular…

If search engines were considered important enough to be a public utility, one could be funded by taxpayer dollars. Now of course, search results can be heavily politicized, but I suppose the same is true of which books a library decides to carry.

Re: Brave launches private search ads

#112

Post by dang »

btbuildem wrote: post #67

HN could do a better title, it seems almost like it's clickbait. The original article title is "Brave debuts privacy-preserving ads in its search engine" - so the HN title kind of implies the opposite. I think paying for content / services is the only way out of.. this. This thing we're in where Advertiser is King. This ecosystem that breeds dark patterns and skews all discourse towards the uninformed and adversarial…

What would be a better (i.e. more accurate and neutral) title?

The article's title sounds too pressreleasey to me, which is a form of misleading+linkbait in its own right, so it was a legit title to rewrite, given HN's rule ("Please use the original title, unless it is misleading or linkbait" - https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html).

Re: Brave launches private search ads

#113

Post by yucky »

travisgriggs wrote: post #105

This statement (second paragraph) > Ads are a key part of search engines, helping to facilitate the free and open exchange of information on the Web, and to connect users to helpful products and services related to their search terms. Is just non sequitur for me. It's said in such a smooth way, in such a gaslight-ish way, that your tempted to just accept it. But it actually makes no sense to me. I get what ads are ke…

   > But I don't see how they increase the free and open exchange of information on the web.
I think I can help explain. Almost all search engine users (~95%+) only scan the first 10-20 results on a query, and those results are dominated by sites that have the budget to spend on SEO. Buying ads gives other voices a chance to break through.

Depending on the niche it can be far more expensive to be on the first page of search results through long term SEO efforts than shorter term, campaign based PPC (paid ads) efforts. This is particularly true for search terms where it may not be known how valuable a top 5 or top 10 position is. It could take months or years and a ton of cash to rank for certain things through SEO efforts alone, only to discover the traffic isn't worth it.

Alternatively, you could test that with PPC and discover quickly and far cheaper if you should spend your time and money trying to rank for something. This then gives smaller voices a chance to amplify.

Re: Brave launches private search ads

#114

Post by dymk »

kevinventullo wrote: post #111
Archipelagia wrote: post #41

Not the biggest fan of Brave myself, but they seem to actually get extra points in my eyes for adding the paid option. It's not like you can pay $3 to Google to get them to stop surveilling you. On a bigger note, monetizing search without ads seem to be a pretty tricky business model. Especially if you want to move beyond being a niche product; even an average HN reader would be hard to convince to pay for a regular…

If search engines were considered important enough to be a public utility, one could be funded by taxpayer dollars. Now of course, search results can be heavily politicized, but I suppose the same is true of which books a library decides to carry.

Search engines are important, but they’re funded quite well with ads, so why would anybody go through the effort to make it a public utility?

Re: Brave launches private search ads

#115

Post by GaryNumanVevo »

Is anyone surprised? Brave was trying to push their own ad network years ago with the BAT (Brave Attention Token) to "pay" websites for eyes on their page. And guess how they paid for it? By running their own ads over native web content.

Edit: Not sure why people are downvoting this. Brave announced the BAT in 2017 and they outlined their plans for an alternative ad network then. https://twitter.com/AttentionToken/status/844929203438964736...

Re: Brave launches private search ads

#116

Post by ramesh31 »

pocketarc wrote: post #13

Ads seem to be a modern virus that infects everything. Everyone who claims "no ads", eventually turns their back on that once they get big enough, even companies with more than enough money from their own products (e.g. Apple, Netflix). I've never seen anything so powerful. I guess it comes down to "no business would say no to free money", but it really is incredible.

>Ads seem to be a modern virus that infects everything. Everyone who claims "no ads", eventually turns their back on that once they get big enough, even companies with more than enough money from their own products (e.g. Apple, Netflix).

TBF at least it's better than the status quo of the late 90's to early 2000s, when the revenue model was malware and actual viruses rather than ad supported.

Re: Brave launches private search ads

#117

Post by NoGravitas »

SeanAnderson wrote: post #101
skinnymuch wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Will manifest 3 really kill modern ad blockers? Like adguard and ublock won’t work as they do now in some upcoming Blink/Chromium version?

They will work but not as well.

Correct: they will work about as well as DNS-based adblockers. The "cosmetic blocks" you depend on in uBlock Origin to block same-origin and in-page elements, the things that make Fandom wikis usable, will not work.

Re: Brave launches private search ads

#118

Post by prmoustache »

paulcole wrote: post #61
prmoustache wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks 3$/month looks like a decent price to me. I might give it a try although I am already running an ad blocker on my browser.

Is there any amount for which you would’ve instantly signed up and started paying or would even $1 a month still be something you “might give a try” (read: won’t do in a million years)?

I won't pay for anything if that doesn't provide me decent search results. This is where the "might give a try" comes from and I would definitely try the version with ads first because I would hate creating an account and giving my card number to another service if I am not 100% sure I am interested. I would also want to know if I need to pay that amont per user in my household or if I would need as many accounts per family member so that the quality of our search results aren't harmed by the difference in interests/history.

3$/month seems decent to me if search results are improved over google. The 10$/month that kagi ask me for are a bit harder to swallow. Not in itself but additionned to all the other 10ish bucks services I am already subscribed to (streaming, backup, etc). There is simply a limit/month I am willing to spend on the whole package and if I spend say n$/month on a search engine per user I will unsubscribe to other services of the same cost. And this is something I may have to negociate with my partner.

The good thing is it is easier to move from and to a paying search engine than say, an instant messaging service.

Re: Brave launches private search ads

#119

Post by Pilottwave »

lots of criticism for brave in this thread. they are the best privacy browser at the moment based on leakage tests for default settings. they got a working add-blocker by default. they have privacy preserving ads because of local in browser matching, your data never leaves the browser for the ads, the ads come to you! they even pay you for watching the ads, and enable you to support creators.

I feel we finally have a privacy respecting browser normal people and tech enthousiast can use, and it puzzles me how it's painted here. let's stay objective

if you don't like the web3 stuff or the blockchain based rewards don't use it. But the web3 space is booming and brave has been nice way to interact with it.

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