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The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

411–420 of 449 posts

Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence

#411

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would take it 1 step farther, if you're not teaching your children how to deal with bullies themselves then you're harming them for life. There's a point at which the child cannot possibly deal with it and you as the parent must step in to protect them, but most of the time if a child learns how to deal with bullies you don't need to.

What would you suggest to teach them? I was never really bullied but worry now about my own son and what to do if he is.

I don't have a clear answer but definitely they should know you have their back, it certainly makes it easier if the child knows you'll support them in it (even when they perhaps did the wrong thing).

Outside of that, they need to be taught that buttholes exist and dealing with them is a fact of life. They shouldn't start things, but they definitely should end them. That was the metric for us while in school, especially if we got into "fisticuffs".

I think for you it's important to understand that school and teachers can't be trusted. I'm not saying teachers suck, but shitty teachers exist. My middle brother once had a teacher take a dislike to him because he corrected her in class. I once had a teacher that would make me stand out in the hall behind the coats on the coat rack. My mother showed up at the school for both, I was pulled from that class and put into another class with a teacher named Mrs Parker, whom I absolutely adored. I still remember the song we would sing at the beginning of class (about parking cars).

My point is that if your child is having an issue with a teacher, don't assume it's the child, my experience is that it very often wasn't. You build trust with your children by SHOWING them that you're there for them. Of course, that doesn't mean every poor interaction with a teacher is the teachers fault. We were dirt poor so I suspect that had something to do with it as well.

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Anyways, none of that is really concrete, I don't know that concrete advice really applies to a question like that. Imo, kids learn what you teach them even if you don't know you're teaching them, and there is no such thing as a single glorifying lesson, it's a slow march over time, exactly as you would do to build trust with someone.

Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence

#412

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I'm not reading all of that, sorry. If a parent isn't preparing children for life as an adult they're bad parents. I'm a bad basketball player and my intent has fuckall to do with that judgement.

For what it's worth, it's a ~50 second read. > I'm a bad basketball player and my intent has fuckall to do with that judgement. Being a bad basketball player doesn't automatically mean you're bad at all sports . And it certainly doesn't mean you're a bad person. > If a parent isn't preparing children for life as an adult they're bad parents. I mostly agree with this statement, but this isn't where we started. And jus…

I think we mostly agree, which is why I said:

> If you're uncomfortable with calling them bad people, then call them bad parents.

Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence

#413

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would take it 1 step farther, if you're not teaching your children how to deal with bullies themselves then you're harming them for life. There's a point at which the child cannot possibly deal with it and you as the parent must step in to protect them, but most of the time if a child learns how to deal with bullies you don't need to.

You sound like you have never met a real bully. Just because a kid is mean and tough doesn't mean they're a bully. Actual bullies have a very keen sense of how the victim might fight back and what it would cost them. And they go ahead with the bullying - breaking down a person, because they can - because they know the victim can't effectively fight back.

The reason people like me don't get bullied is because I learned (and was taught) very early on to stand up for myself.

I once had a teacher make me stand outside in the hall behind the coats in the coat rack (ALL DAY), don't tell me I know nothing about bullies.

Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence

#414

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if private schools are a way that rich kids can afford to be different but poor kids can't. See https://sfstandard.com/business/inside-ftx-founder-sam-bankm... Would rich kids be facing much more competition for elite spots from poor but smart kids if bullying wasn't part of the curriculum in the public schools? Given that only 10% of kids get to go to a school where dignity is assured, it could be that 90%…

I don't know about the US, but bullying in "schools for rich kids" is legendary in the UK

George Orwell wrote about it. It's a theme that turns up time and time again in the lyrics of Pink Floyd.

Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence

#415
post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, this is true. Statistically, we know many serial killers are actually victims of brain trauma as children (usually through being violently beaten) and we know traumatic brain injury can cause aggression. In fact there's a predictive relationship between childhood trauma and juvenile psychopathy. [0] 0. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29598432/ " Results indicate that psychopathy is significantly correlated with c…

Following up with an argument full of terms like "many" and "can" is not enough to support an absolute claim in either direction.

That's why I cited a source that explicitly said there was a predictive relationship found. Please read my entire post?

Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence

#416

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You sound like you have never met a real bully. Just because a kid is mean and tough doesn't mean they're a bully. Actual bullies have a very keen sense of how the victim might fight back and what it would cost them. And they go ahead with the bullying - breaking down a person, because they can - because they know the victim can't effectively fight back.

The reason people like me don't get bullied is because I learned (and was taught) very early on to stand up for myself. I once had a teacher make me stand outside in the hall behind the coats in the coat rack (ALL DAY), don't tell me I know nothing about bullies.

Was that before you learned to stand up for yourself, then? Or wasn't it bullying?

Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence

#417

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My personal experience was that Western schooling was much kinder than Asian (Indian) schooling (parent's job had me moving countries every 3 years). Having been a bit of an outsider in both systems (didn't have the years of shared history in Western circles and accent was too American in Asian circles) and extremely timid, while I did initially get bullied in Western schools, it was nowhere near as pervasive, underh…

As someone who went through the Indian education system, teachers were some of the worst bullies who would frequently abuse their power. - A teacher posed a question to the class and I and another boy answered immediately. The teacher was upset and said "cliquecover and boy are always putting themselves forward" - A few senior students demo'ed a cool robotics toy they'd built. Our science teacher mocked our class for…

Yes that roughly agrees with my experiences and the stories from friends and family. Luckily I just barely dodged having to deal with board exams and Indian university.

Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence

#418

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is a fair description of the error. "the well adjusted adults I know easily resolve issues without violence" does not mean that you should expect the same results for all adults, or for all children.

The original assertion I disputed was that we should accept that the social dynamics in a school match those of a prison. Certainly I don’t pretend there aren’t environments where adults are violent and unreasonable. Such as prisons, or other places with “people who regularly commit violence, rape, and beat their wives.” If your argument is that school environments must be similarly unpleasant because they take stude…

You can hold schools to any standard you want, but that does not mean it is actually achievable. My point was that being able to meet high standards with functioning adults is not evidence that it can be met with non-functioning children

Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence

#419

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Similarly, to have a tolerant society, intolerance can't be tolerated.

For the downvoters: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance

If I were to guess the cause of the downvotes it might have been a reflexive action from seeing the numerous times the paradox of tolerance is brought up but then misapplied in a way that suits whatever poster's rhetorical purpose yet deviates significantly from Popper's definition. To be clear, I'm not saying you did that, just offering a possible explanation.

Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence

#420

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reason people like me don't get bullied is because I learned (and was taught) very early on to stand up for myself. I once had a teacher make me stand outside in the hall behind the coats in the coat rack (ALL DAY), don't tell me I know nothing about bullies.

Was that before you learned to stand up for yourself, then? Or wasn't it bullying?

from another comment of mine:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33808521

> There's a point at which the child cannot possibly deal with it and you as the parent must step in to protect them, but most of the time if a child learns how to deal with bullies you don't need to.

And the next step isn't to start arguing about what does, and doesn't, constitute a bully.

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The way my mother tells it, I started crying when I got into the car after school and wouldn't tell her what was going on. After the 3rd day in a row she got very insistent, I finally told her and she never left that parking lot before having it cleared up with the school. They removed me from her class and put me in another class with a teacher named Mrs Parker (whom I adored).

You're mistaken if you think my argument is that there aren't situations in which the parent MUST step in.

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