Live data from Hacker News

Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

reuters.com

741–750 of 903 posts

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#741

Internet companies should boycott the App Store and pull their apps at the same time.

Can you please further describe what an internet company is? I haven't heard the term internet company since the late 90s (for all tech) except recently when referring to Comcast, AT&T which I don't think is what you are referring to.

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#742

Internet companies should boycott the App Store and pull their apps at the same time.

Can you please further describe what an internet company is? I haven't heard the term internet company since the late 90s (for all tech) except recently when referring to Comcast, AT&T which I don't think is what you are referring to.

I'm thinking companies that don't really have physical presence like TikTok, Instagram, Facebook, Roblox, Spotify, etc.

Companies that if kicked off the App store would face an existential crisis.

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#743

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand where you are coming from, and support you on that. On the other hand, I'm pretty happy with the default state of an iPhone. It just manages itself, and all that hard problems (backups, updates, ease of use, experience homogenity, etc.) are solved. I manage more than enough servers at work, and I don't want to manage another server in my pocket, do nitty-gritty settings, allow selected apps background ac…

Would giving people the ability to opt out of Apple's ultra-managed experience and take more control over their device harm your ability to continue to enjoy those benefits? I heard an argument like this a lot at the start of discussions about whether we should be able to choose to WFH in the longer term. "I don't want to WFH because..." Ok, sure, but nobody is trying to force you to. It might just be me, and I'll de…

> * "I don't want to WFH because..." Ok, sure, but nobody is trying to force you to.*

When I was last looking for a job, I clearly stated that I did not want to work from home and that I was only interested in onsite. Out of dozens of recruiters contacting me, only 1 respected that desire.

I share a house with my sister and she has terrible boundary issues (the places she socialized with others closed and went out of business from the Covid shutdowns). Her refusal to stop "visiting" during working hours cost me 2 jobs.

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#744
post #559

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd say yes if console makers would force all 3rd parties to not directly advertise how to create an account with them and pay through their own means for a subscription when needed instead of the console game store. I'd say yes if stores with their own store brands would force producers of 3rd party products to always pay a 30% cut and disallow the consumers from being able to purchase the product at a different pla…

Consoles have forced third party game makers to pay a license fee for every physical game sold since the 80s no matter where you sold the game.

My example was about subscriptions, no console maker takes a cut of a subscription to a game done through the game publisher's own servers/service. No console maker takes a cut from sales of digital items done through the game's platform.

You are moving the goalposts, licencing is a well established practice and only interferes with the sale of the initial product: the game, not subsequent upsales where the console maker has absolutely no interaction with, just like royalties for IP and so on, it's another broken analogy...

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#745
post #646

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not only whataboutism but also broken analogies. I can't think of a proper analogy to the market power that Apple holds by having the whole platform coupled with devices that people don't have that many other choices (Android vs iOS, that's basically it). I can always try to twist the analogy to bring it closer to the actual reality of the issue at hand but it's always an uphill battle to dismember it and re-create t…

> can't think of a proper analogy to the market power that Apple holds by having the whole platform coupled with devices that people don't have that many other choices There are three console makers as opposed to two major phone manufacturers. How is that different?

You can release your games for PCs and have enough market share to be sustainable. You can't just release your app on the web and have the exact same experience as a native application, there's no alternative with enough market share for mobile platforms.

Do you really not see a difference between these worlds or are you being purposefully obtuse and ignoring reality to try to push your point?

It's again an example from HN threads/commenters completely ignoring degree and level of issues and instead forcing a black-and-white view with broken analogies...

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#746
post #3

No substance, same arguments repeated from both sides all the time. Seems like a stalemate. I see to ways out for a company that feels it’s getting ripped of by Apple: 1. Don’t publish in App Store, do a web app or encourage your customers to get a different platform device. Not sure which one since Google Play Store AFAIK has the same rules. 2. Charge users +30% more when buying through IAP if same is offered any pl…

Option 1 is made more difficult by the fact that Apple prevents alternative web browser engines on iOS and does not implement modern PWA features in the one they do allow (their own)

It absolutely undermines the credibility of that argument

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#747

It's pretty obvious that legislation or anti-trust action will come that opens up mobile computing platforms. Considering the whole of a large market share mobile computing OS a private market, and not subject to competitive pressures, leads to monopolistic capture similar to what utilities could achieve without regulation. Why not just move to another neighborhood if you don't like your electric bill? Well then you'…

I'm less optimistic about the inevitability of this in the United States. We haven't been able to maintain competition in any utility spaces I can think of -- internet, cable, gas, electricity, etc. There's no freedom of choice in the healthcare industry either. In many parts of the country, almost all grocery stores are part of the same massive conglomerate. The FCC is completely captured by the ISPs, and currently…

Funny that the monopolies you mention are all highly regulated industries with government-granted monopolies.

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#748

I want the option to control my devices. I don’t understand the arguments that claim Apple needs to rule the device with an iron fist. What problems does it cause to make the locked down experience the default with the option for me to disable that and take control of the device after I buy it? I want to own my stuff. I want to repair it and I want complete control over it. I think that in 10 years we’ll all have car…

If you had the option to sideload apps, Facebook might have pressured you to do that (and leave them free from Apple’s oversight) or lose your friends. Because you can’t, Apple was able to have privacy controls imposed upon them kicking and screaming.

You may argue this argument is wrong, but it’s not like it is totally incomprehensible.

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#749

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you please further describe what an internet company is? I haven't heard the term internet company since the late 90s (for all tech) except recently when referring to Comcast, AT&T which I don't think is what you are referring to.

I'm thinking companies that don't really have physical presence like TikTok, Instagram, Facebook, Roblox, Spotify, etc. Companies that if kicked off the App store would face an existential crisis.

So you want them to operate like a cartel? I guess they aren't price setting but they are flexing together.

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#750
The argument that users should have the option to control their own phone (which perhaps only a small fraction of users would select) seems pretty reasonable, but what if it less about Apple execs being control freaks, and more about support costs. I can certainly imagine that if even less than 1% of Apple users exercised the option to escape from Apple control, that small fraction could have support costs that quickly matched the support costs of the 99% that stayed in the garden. So perhaps Apple could a more-unlocked iPhone that enabled more user control, but cost 2 - 3X as much as the "locked" version. My guess is that even with a 50% surcharge, which would be unlikely to cover additional costs, it probably would not sell.
Post reply on HN