Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo • Hacker News Board

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#211

Post by api » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 1:37 AM UTC

ProAm wrote: post #148

s3p wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How so? I think their strides in fields like differential privacy show how willing they are to protect their end users.

I personally think their migration to subscription based revenue and advertising says differently (just personal opinion). Were now the product with Apple too, not the customer. We used to pay more to not deal with that.

It seems that advertisers can outbid users to the point that nobody is willing to pay enough to be the customer.

The amount of money in advertising is staggering. Can it actually work that well? Or is this a category of spending that just tends to be greenlit in big companies?

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#212

Post by SllX » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 1:38 AM UTC

pessimizer wrote: post #136

SllX wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Zealots are a normal feature of human society, so yes.

There are a lot of people who spend a significant part of their day posting over and over again about Elon Musk, and congratulating each other for it. I assume that's not being a zealot. It's like the people posting about "Putin's cock" 100 times a day who think that it's actually the other people who are obsessed with him.

Correct. Anti-zealotry is another form of zealotry; like atheists who are militantly atheist rather than just chill about it, but all of that too is just normal people being normal.

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#213

Post by halpmeh » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 1:38 AM UTC

tshaddox wrote: post #202

halpmeh wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Android allows 3rd party app stores, you can side load apps, and you can install a different OS.

Isn't the fact that Google Play charges 30% even when Android allows 3rd party app stores an indication that the 30% fee is not caused by a lack of competition in app stores?

Perhaps, or maybe the revenue generated by Android is so small that it isn’t worth the effort to change app stores.

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#214

Post by api » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 1:39 AM UTC

dmix wrote: post #166

fishcrackers wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like being able to trust my device and my kids device, if you wan't something to hack on get a pinephone or something the reality is that billions of people need to trust their phones with their most personal information, fininaces and lives and apple's policies while sometimes annoying do a lot to build that trust they aren't a big secret and if you don't like it you're free to not buy their products

Apple could still have a "developer" mode you have to jump through a complicated technical process to enable...just like MacOS let's you disable system integrity protection by running a terminal command and rebooting into a boot disk then running another terminal command. It could void support plans so it's not Apple's problem. That wouldn't affect your kids and telling Grandma how to do that over the phone is very d…

It’d be easy to gate this: require that the iOS device be connected to a Mac and a special app used to change “advanced” settings. These could include side loading, the ability to install alternate app stores, and low level OS access of various kinds.

It would be very helpful to developers and debugging too.

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#215

Post by smoldesu » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 1:40 AM UTC

isatty wrote: post #168

pchristensen wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I want Apple to maintain a consistent set of rules that app developers need to follow. I have no power to dictate my desirable terms to Facebook, Twitter, etc, but Apple does. I'm willing to give up some flexibility with my device for that. No matter what, I'm a tiny player with no power against globally powerful tech companies, but I'll take Apple's conditions vs 1) conditions set out by other companies that I trust…

That and I want to give my not so technologically literate parents an iPhone and I want it to just work. I want a consistent experience that’ll let me debug their problems from around the world or just feel confident sending them to the Apple store. Even for a power user like me, I’d rather have an ultra reliable device with amazing manufacturer warranty than something I can hack on.

> I’d rather have an ultra reliable device with amazing manufacturer warranty than something I can hack on.

You can have all three, though. Apple simply stops you from harnessing the true potential of your device because it threatens their bottom line. This is immediately apparent when you realize that any form of sideloading requires a $99/year subscription fee. Absolutely bonkers that they get away with this and people defend them anyways.

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#216

Post by mulligan » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 1:42 AM UTC

halpmeh wrote: post #213

tshaddox wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't the fact that Google Play charges 30% even when Android allows 3rd party app stores an indication that the 30% fee is not caused by a lack of competition in app stores?

Perhaps, or maybe the revenue generated by Android is so small that it isn’t worth the effort to change app stores.

You overestimate the size of the app store. It is big, but that doesn't mean the remaining 37% of app economy is small.

> iOS was responsible for 63% of total app revenue in 2021

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#217

Post by majormajor » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 1:42 AM UTC

satvikpendem wrote: post #208

marricks wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Both your links go to the same Proton article and the heart of it seems to be this: > Apple monitors your every move in the App Store and its News and Stocks apps and then uses that data to sell ads targeting you in those same apps. To meet its growth forecasts, experts expect Apple to start selling ads in its Maps, Podcast, and Books apps, meaning it could replicate this model across more of its services. Much more…

Why do you assume Apple doesn't also track every website and email you read (especially if you use the default Apple-made apps)? After all, they make the OS, they can track whatever they want.

Nobody's reported seeing that sort of network traffic sent off of iOS devices. It's trivially easy to spot it, and it's well documented, going to Google and others across the web, though.

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#218

Post by naet » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 1:43 AM UTC

judge2020 wrote: post #144

wvenable wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The real solution to this is improved functionality of web apps and complete migration to those Progress on that front is hampered because fruit company only allows their own browser and puts just enough effort into it to keep it relevant as a web browser.

But I see way too many people using Chrome on iOS or the Google App as their main web browser. If it was really about the underlying technology then nobody would download alternative web browsers, but they do, so surely people decide to use these browser apps based on their features like password support, tab design and functionality, etc.

Chrome on iOS basically has to suffer almost all the same bugs and issues as Safari on iOS because only one underlying browser engine is allowed by Apple on their iOS devices (Webkit, which is maintained by Apple).

In this case the window-dressing is different but the technology underneath is largely the same.

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#219

Post by jonathankoren » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 1:43 AM UTC

ProAm wrote: post #148

s3p wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How so? I think their strides in fields like differential privacy show how willing they are to protect their end users.

I personally think their migration to subscription based revenue and advertising says differently (just personal opinion). Were now the product with Apple too, not the customer. We used to pay more to not deal with that.

There’s a huge difference, including from a privacy perspective, between subscriptions and internet targeted advertising.

How are you the product, when you’re giving money? That’s like saying, when you buy a ticket to Black Panther, you are the product Hollywood is selling, not the movie.

Re: Spotify CEO renews attack on Apple after Musk's salvo

#220

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 1:44 AM UTC

CogitoCogito wrote: post #181

endisneigh wrote: post #86

Stop buying Apple if you don't like it. Seriously. At the end of the day all of these companies would do the exact same thing as Apple if they were in Apple's position. The real solution to this is improved functionality of web apps and complete migration to those, then you can be free of the duopoly. Other than using phone specific features, why can't all apps run on your desktop, laptop or elsewhere? I'll never get…

Another solution is to pass legislation making Apple's business model illegal.

[deleted]