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UK high street banks are quarantining from crypto

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Re: UK high street banks are quarantining from crypto

#91

Post by shapefrog »

isthisthingon99 wrote: post #84
shapefrog wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is value in being able to anonymously and stably transfer value uncensored. Let me know when this comes into existence, because it might be interesting.

It exists, Monero. But it isn't necessarily a stable value, though I think it will hit a stable value at some point. For some reason, I can't post so here is my reply to the guy below me: Current XMRUSD volatility is ~40% Current USDJPY volatility is ~38% I believe in due time, when the pump and dumpers are gone, it will become as stable as normal currency pairs.

It exists, but it doesnt exist yet.

I AM A billionaire! Well not necessarily yet, I only have 4 dollars and 53 cents, though I think it will hit that net worth level at some point in the future.

Re: UK high street banks are quarantining from crypto

#92

Post by antihero »

killingtime74 wrote: post #62
antihero wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish there was a switch that let me accept the consequences of my own actions but be allowed to take them in the first place. I don’t use crypto but it isn’t my bank’s job to tell me where I can send my money.

There is a switch. Don't associate with the banks for your finances. Take your money out. No one is forcing you to keep it there.

Real practical advice there.

Re: UK high street banks are quarantining from crypto

#93

Post by isthisthingon99 »

mjburgess wrote: post #89
isthisthingon99 wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By automated control leading to feudalism, I presume you mean deflation leads to feudalism? I'm a fan of automated control, but with an algorithmically set inflation rate, I don't see why it would lead to feudalism.

No one controls inflation, the only variable under control is the cost for a bank to receive money from a central bank (an interest rate). Any value of an interest rate is a political tradeoff: a low rate favours spending, a high rate favours saving. So a low rate promotes expansion and an excess of cash in the system; a high rate promotes contraction and a relative deficit of cash. No value for an interest rate is "…

I can see where you're going with this. An algorithmic approach without a political fallback can lead to feudalism because the people who control the algorithm, control everything.

This is why I teeter on "end the fed". You need an independent body not influenced by the politics, yet accountable for their performance in the end. I'm not sure they're currently accountable in a manner that matters.

Edit: when I say inflation in this context, I mean monetary inflation. That can be controlled.

Edit 2: I'm not really sure how the current system is that far from feudalism. They are literally talking about putting the plebs out of work so their (feudal overlords) cash isn't made worthless.

Re: UK high street banks are quarantining from crypto

#94

Post by rwmj »

SilverBirch wrote: post #65

I really don't understand what place your bank has telling you where you're allowed to send money. If I want to throw a small percentage of my net worth into a hugely speculative investment then fine, why are they stopping me? Are they stopping me from using my bank card down at the dog tracks or at a casino? Can I withdraw cash for Poker but not blackjack? Having said that, it's weird because I definitely have sent…

This isn't about sophisticated investors wanting to bet 1% of their net worth on a speculative investment. It's about preventing ordinary people wiring their life savings to scams like OneCoin (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-49826161).

Re: UK high street banks are quarantining from crypto

#95

Post by selfhoster11 »

edent wrote: post #40
tibanne wrote: post #6

How about letting people do what they want with their own money?

People can do what they want with their money. In this case, they can move their money to one of the many banks who don't place restrictions on transactions. The beauty of the free market is that people are free to move their custom. And businesses are free to set the limitations necessary for profitable enterprise. Some banks have decided that the risk to having to support customers who engage in risky behaviour is…

> In this case, they can move their money to one of the many banks who don't place restrictions on transactions.

Voting with your feet doesn't work. Moreover, banks or credit card processors shouldn't be the arbiters of what you should be allowed to spend your money on.

Re: UK high street banks are quarantining from crypto

#96

Post by selfhoster11 »

beardyw wrote: post #7

Looking at the actual report, only Monzo and Revolut (yes, I haven't heard of them either) are "crypto friendly". The others could best be described as wary and watchful.

Monzo has been known for freezing accounts at the drop of a hat in the past, possibly for cryptocurrency related reasons if /r/Monzo is to be believed.

Revolut is not a good bank.

Re: UK high street banks are quarantining from crypto

#97

Post by lucozade »

SilverBirch wrote: post #65

I really don't understand what place your bank has telling you where you're allowed to send money. If I want to throw a small percentage of my net worth into a hugely speculative investment then fine, why are they stopping me? Are they stopping me from using my bank card down at the dog tracks or at a casino? Can I withdraw cash for Poker but not blackjack? Having said that, it's weird because I definitely have sent…

There are various guarantees and payment codes of conduct that UK banks have signed up to. The intent of these is to give some protection if you've made a payment to a scammer.

What I presume is happening is that some banks are seeing a significant increase in applications for that protection from crypto transactions. Or are expecting to see such.

It doesn't apply when you withdraw cash as you have no recourse to protection from the bank if you subsequently lose that money. And you might be restricted from using you card at a casino if your bank has seen significant claims from said casino.

One can, of course, argue whether or not such protections should exist. As in, run the retail banking system on a caveat emptor basis. But that's not how it works in the UK and, whilst it doesn't, it's not unreasonable for the bank's to limit their liability.

Re: UK high street banks are quarantining from crypto

#98

Post by jakupovic »

gambiting wrote: post #82
bluescrn wrote: post #19

They've banned crypto, but actual gambling is more popular and more heavily advertised then ever

Gambling is a lot more regulated though. And it doesn't have the tendency to say "hey bet all of your life savings with us, you can't lose!" like crypto does.

I logged into a gambling site and saw that you could make $5000 individual BlackJack bets. $5k a bet is a lot of money and gone in a second. This is not well regulated and needs help. With crypto you at least have some sh*tcoin left, with online casinos nothing.

Re: UK high street banks are quarantining from crypto

#99

Post by shapefrog »

antihero wrote: post #55
automatic6131 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>that banks cannot be trusted to let you do what you want with your own money. Well that's because we put them partially on the hook for when we, Joey Public, fall for scams, we expect and demand that the banks give us back the money we were scammed for. I mean, I personally haven't, but I've read multiple newspaper articles about it.

I wish there was a switch that let me accept the consequences of my own actions but be allowed to take them in the first place. I don’t use crypto but it isn’t my bank’s job to tell me where I can send my money.

There is/was before. You have to waive rights to get that switch enabled, in the past when I looked at what that meant - it was waiving litterally any recourse over any money extracted from your account by any means.

Re: UK high street banks are quarantining from crypto

#100

Post by shapefrog »

selfhoster11 wrote: post #95
edent wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People can do what they want with their money. In this case, they can move their money to one of the many banks who don't place restrictions on transactions. The beauty of the free market is that people are free to move their custom. And businesses are free to set the limitations necessary for profitable enterprise. Some banks have decided that the risk to having to support customers who engage in risky behaviour is…

> In this case, they can move their money to one of the many banks who don't place restrictions on transactions. Voting with your feet doesn't work. Moreover, banks or credit card processors shouldn't be the arbiters of what you should be allowed to spend your money on.

Of course it does - I have had banks close my accounts as they did not want to be associated with me. I opened accounts elsewhere and carried on.

I am free to do my business, they are free to not take my business. We are all free.

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