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Lab-Grown Meat Is Safe to Eat, FDA Says

smithsonianmag.com

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Re: Lab-Grown Meat Is Safe to Eat, FDA Says

#171

Post by Alcor »

matrix_overload wrote: post #58
superkuh wrote: post #33

It will be animal cells differentiated into muscle tissues on collagen scaffolds initially. The technology comes from attempts to grow functional organs (ie, liver) that are biocompatible in the body serum proper. If there aren't health effects from transplantation within the animal type you can probably eat the animal tissues just fine. It's the same thing. It's meat. It's just without the animal suffering. And hope…

For context, the life of an average herbivore in the wild consists of living with no shelter in harsh weather while having to fear every sound. And it typically ends by being ripped to pieces by a predator and eaten alive while the brain still has some residual oxygen and awareness. The typical farmed animal experience where you are sheltered, vaccinated against common illnesses, provided food and slaughtered after b…

I’m not going to try to argue about which experience is worse because that’s difficult to quantify and I don’t actually think it achieves a lot.

If we can agree that ignoring nature, factory farmed animals don’t lead what we would call a fulfilling life, how can we justify bringing trillions of them into existence if we have alternatives? We don‘t have to go too deep into utilitarian rhetoric here, maybe it is better than nature, maybe if you follow that line of reasoning it wouldn’t be right to let animals suffer in nature or have children either. Anyway, I haven’t been able to justify eating meat to myself for as long as I was able to think along these lines.

Re: Lab-Grown Meat Is Safe to Eat, FDA Says

#172

Post by hcurtiss »

bsdz wrote: post #104
matrix_overload wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For context, the life of an average herbivore in the wild consists of living with no shelter in harsh weather while having to fear every sound. And it typically ends by being ripped to pieces by a predator and eaten alive while the brain still has some residual oxygen and awareness. The typical farmed animal experience where you are sheltered, vaccinated against common illnesses, provided food and slaughtered after b…

I'm not sure I buy your argument. For example, pigs have an average lifespan of 15-20 years but in a farm setting are slaughtered at 6 months old. Also I suspect a pig is more adapted to its natural environment than living in a confined shelter (often less than a square metre). In fact, in the UK, less than 1 in 20 pigs are allowed to go outside - hardly a good life! This is just pigs.

I saw an Oregon Field Guide that said between cougars, wolves, and bears, the predation/death rate for deer fawns in NE Oregon is something over 90%. I don't know about wild pigs, per se, but I don't think it's appropriate to presume they'd live so long. Many would die soon after birth. As for their conditions, many livestock we consume are raised in relatively natural conditions (e.g., cattle run on arid ground in eastern Oregon). Their lives are certainly shorter than maybe they could be, but see my first comment.

Re: Lab-Grown Meat Is Safe to Eat, FDA Says

#173

Post by prometheus76 »

h2odragon wrote: post #126
prometheus76 wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm talking about while you are growing the meat, whether it be in a natural system that is self-regulating and with an immune system, or in a vat where any contamination will spread rampantly. That's one of the biggest problems with lab-grown meat: if you make it at a scale that is economically feasible, the chance for contamination is so high that very few batches will make it through the process, and will have to…

We do large batch cheeses and beers and other things like that; which are similar enough that they'll offer useful pointers. "Meat" cultures might well be more subject to contamination because of the conditions required, but still. It's not a new problems and there's solutions that have worked for similar cases. I do not think they will be able to compete economically with the backyard chicken, for example; but I'm n…

Those are much simpler yeasts and molds being cultivated. Meat cells are much more complex from an inputs/outputs point of view, and much more prone to contamination, especially at scales that are economically feasible.

Re: Lab-Grown Meat Is Safe to Eat, FDA Says

#174

Post by coldpie »

dalbasal wrote: post #137

Polling my own bubble, I'm dubious about lab meat. Across the board, it seems that people want lab grown meat for others. Vegans want omnivores to eat it. Omnivores think it'd be good for vegans. Meanwhile, any mass market product is likely to be some sort of processed meat product. Sausage, mince chicken nugget or somesuch. These aren't generally premium products, so you need to go really low for price competitivene…

If we priced externalities at their true societal cost, the problem of animal farming becomes clear very quickly. Reducing carbon emissions from animal agriculture is one of the bigger targets for helping reduce climate change. I don't think telling people to just not eat meat will work, so lab-grown meat seems like a promising solution to explore.

https://www.epa.gov/ghgemissions/sources-greenhouse-gas-emis...

Re: Lab-Grown Meat Is Safe to Eat, FDA Says

#175

Post by ecshafer »

dalbasal wrote: post #137

Polling my own bubble, I'm dubious about lab meat. Across the board, it seems that people want lab grown meat for others. Vegans want omnivores to eat it. Omnivores think it'd be good for vegans. Meanwhile, any mass market product is likely to be some sort of processed meat product. Sausage, mince chicken nugget or somesuch. These aren't generally premium products, so you need to go really low for price competitivene…

My bubble mostly doesn't care. I would say my bubble isn't particularly naturalist or organic leaning so that might be it. I will definitely eat lab grown meat, especially for something like ground beef or chicken nuggets or sausage.

Re: Lab-Grown Meat Is Safe to Eat, FDA Says

#176

Post by Vecr »

ncallaway wrote: post #141
runarberg wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's meat. It's just without the animal suffering Are you sure about the no suffering part. Currently this meat is grown using a growth medium most often extracted from a pregnant mare using a technique called bloodletting which is often extremely painful for the animal. EDIT: I think I’m actually wrong about the pregnant mare. Animal suffering through bloodletting from pregnant mares was a recent scandal where I’m…

> from a pregnant mare I’m quite skeptical about this. How do they obtain and culture chicken cells from a horse?

Not the cells, but the growth medium. You need a growth medium to grow cells in a culture, because there's no support from the rest of the animal for growth. Normally the animal would provide blood, etc. to the tissue, but there is no animal in this case.

Re: Lab-Grown Meat Is Safe to Eat, FDA Says

#177

Post by no-dr-onboard »

It's concerning to me how long the time horizon of public science is becoming. There is little scientific consensus on the topic of laboratory grown mass nutrient bioavailability. There is little consensus on the mid-long term effects that this has on intestinal flora.

I'm inclined to believe that the FDA is making statements on authority at this point.

Re: Lab-Grown Meat Is Safe to Eat, FDA Says

#179

Post by epgui »

zenburnmyface wrote: post #142
runarberg wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's meat. It's just without the animal suffering Are you sure about the no suffering part. Currently this meat is grown using a growth medium most often extracted from a pregnant mare using a technique called bloodletting which is often extremely painful for the animal. EDIT: I think I’m actually wrong about the pregnant mare. Animal suffering through bloodletting from pregnant mares was a recent scandal where I’m…

It’s call FBS, and it can be grown in a lab, too (if it’s even required…). See companies like Future Fields.

In practice, artificial FBS or FBS-free medium can be very tricky to use successfully. It's definitely not a solved problem yet.

Re: Lab-Grown Meat Is Safe to Eat, FDA Says

#180

Post by achou »

David Humbird's 2021 paper "Scale-up economics for cultured meat"[1] is a pretty damning study of the problems with lab-grown meat. His core conclusion: "Capital- and operating-cost analyses of conceptual cell-mass production facilities indicate economics that would likely preclude the affordability of their products as food."

Does anyone know if the problems that Humbird describes have somehow been solved?

[1] https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/bit.27848

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