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The Citroen Ami – tiny electric car with no boot, 28mph top speed, 46 mile range

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321–330 of 363 posts

Re: The Citroen Ami – tiny electric car with no boot, 28mph top speed, 46 mile range

#321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it’s raining/snowing, or too hot, or too cold, I’d much rather be in an small enclosed car than exposed to the elements on a bike. The Ami has a primitive heater but no air conditioning, but there’s no reason that these limitations are inherent to a vehicle of this size. I imagine an Ami-sized car with creature comforts of a regular vehicle would sell extremely well in cities. Biking is great when the weather is a…

> If it’s raining/snowing, or too hot, or too cold, I’d much rather be in an small enclosed car than exposed to the elements on a bike. Yes and no. I have a three wheeler cargo bike I use for most of my commuting or city riding and very rarely do I opt for my car, particularly when the weather is bad. The main reason is that since where I live I basically cannot find parking and when the weather is bad, the roads are…

Also, drivers are pretty much blind and drive stupidly in the rain. I'd rather be in a separate bike path in that case.

Re: The Citroen Ami – tiny electric car with no boot, 28mph top speed, 46 mile range

#322
post #183
post #17

> And you don't need to have any form of licence to drive one in France! FWIW, that's wrong: only people born before 1985 ~ (i don't know the exact date) don't need any license. People born after that do require a license, which is much much lighter than standard driving license in France, but still requires several hours (I think it takes a whole day?), which I think is equivalent to what actual driving license in s…

Yes, you need the "Permis AM" if you are born in 1988 or after. This category of cars is still often referred as "license less cars" though.

The article is still kinda right in the sense that the AM license is only a certification that you got a formation, there in no exam to get it.

Re: The Citroen Ami – tiny electric car with no boot, 28mph top speed, 46 mile range

#323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You shouldn’t be on roads that are heavily trafficked by fast moving vehicles with this kind of vehicle in the first place. I own an electric Ranger (not Highway legal) for around my place and it fills a real need. There is no need for airbags or anything of the like on it. I didn’t even bother purchasing it with a windshield. The biggest threat to me in that vehicle is the dense vegetation and steep hills I often dr…

*> You shouldn’t be on roads that are heavily trafficked Please help me understand. NEVs are road-worthy but not all-roads-worthy? Is there any law against NEVs in heavily trafficked roads? If not, it's left to common sense?

In France they're banned from highways, but legal on most other roads.

In practice though, since they're limited to 45 km/h, people avoid driving them on anything way faster than that

Re: The Citroen Ami – tiny electric car with no boot, 28mph top speed, 46 mile range

#325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

*Cars as defined by “car people”. Personally I couldn’t care less if my “car looks like a car.” (I don’t even know what that means.) I want it to get me from A to B with a minimum of financial and environmental expense.

Most people care a lot.

Some people are very passionate about it. I don't think most people care, though that's probably a cultural thing

Re: The Citroen Ami – tiny electric car with no boot, 28mph top speed, 46 mile range

#326
post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A bullet has more kinetic energy because it's significantly faster than a bike that's part of the problem. The bullet is also shaped to cause damages If the same 50 grams were a disc of few microns of thickness and a diameter of 50 cm, they would be much less dangerous. A bike is shaped like a battering ram, an Ami has to pass very rigorous safety tests and is shaped to cause the less damage possible on impact, bec…

>So a bike going 20mph is more dangerous than an Ami going 25mph. This is absurd. It makes me really doubt if you have any understanding of physics. I also don't appreciate you editing your earlier posts to pad out your arguments.

> This is absurd. It makes me really doubt if you have any understanding of physics.

You are looking at the problem from the wrong angle.

Weight is not the issue.

How about this: would you prefer to be hit full force in the face with a pillow weighting 1Kg or with a bar of steel weighting the same 1Kg?

Or maybe you would prefer to be hit with a metal ruler weighting less than 100 grams.

Sounds better than 1Kg, doesn't it?

I don't know you, but I would choose the pillow any time.

I might be wrong, but I think that density is discussed in physics too.

The point is not that a bike runs as fast as a bullet, but that a bike is basically a bar of very hard, very dense, very rigid, indeformable stuff (metal and/or composite materials) like a bullet, while a car is made in a way that in case of impact its deformable body absorbs a good chunk of the kinetic energy.

The same way being hit with a piece of metal embedded in a pillow causes less harm than being hit by the naked piece of metal, even though the weight of the pillow + metal bar is higher than the metal bar alone.

TBH a car is a very heavy pillow, running too fast too often, but looking at just 15 years ago cars have gone a very long way towards safety, bikes haven't, they have in fact gained a brand new clean and green engine, becoming much heavier, much faster and much more dangerous.

The bicycle is also more dangerous for the occupant, it's irrelevant what the biker hits, could be a wall, a car, a bus, another person, the person riding the bike will be projected forward at the same speed she was riding, no way to stop it, no safety mechanism.

That's why in the Netherlands are worried about "fewer road fatalities but more serious bike accidents" and are thinking about making it mandatory to wear an helmet when riding a bike.

I'm quite sure the problem is speed.

Specifically they state that

- the number of motorcyclists or moped drivers who died following an accident increased by 24 victims to 101 last year

- While the overall number of road fatalities has reached a seven-year low, number of cyclists seriously injured in accidents continues to rise, data released by Dutch safety organisation SafetyNL reveals that the number of cyclists seriously injured in road accidents has increased by a third over the past 10 years likely as a result of the rise in popularity of the e-bike. (too fast, maybe?)

When we talk about safety, rising numbers are always a net negative, no matter the reason why. Cars are getting safer, bikes are getting less safe over time.

Bikes are not for everybody, I think not everyone should drive a car, but slower, lighter, smaller, mostly made of derformable plastic city cars will have a major impact on urban transportation, while bikes will not.

Let's talk about it in 5 years, I bet I won't be proved wrong.

maybe a video made by someone "addicted to cycling and coffee", living in a very bike friendly Country, will give you some more perspective.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3s2gVxLN9Q

Re: The Citroen Ami – tiny electric car with no boot, 28mph top speed, 46 mile range

#327
post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Cars are WAY more dangerous than bicycles wrong. cars are more dangerous on average (the concept of average should be banned from any statistical analysis) because they travel many many many more kilometers than the average bike and mostly for very long distances at high speed. But if you notice, I wrote "than slow 4 wheeled cars". Ami is much safer than a bike, especially for the occupants. Example: there are 3.75…

>Bike users deaths caused by street accidents have been 50 in the same year. and most of those deaths were caused by cars.

> and most of those deaths were caused by cars

Or by the humans driving them?

It's no surprise that the most common vehicle is involved in most of the fatal accidents.

Absolute numbers are not very interesting in this context, the difference in number of vehicles is at least an order of magnitude, it's obvious that cars are top of the list, like adults cause most of the homicides and you won't find many toddlers there.

As a data point, when Rome was in lockdown and cars were banned from the streets, accidents involving bikes and other means of transport like e-scooters, went up 5x and hospitalizations to HR went up 3x for the same kinds of accidents, compared to when cars were allowed to drive around.

Re: The Citroen Ami – tiny electric car with no boot, 28mph top speed, 46 mile range

#328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Netherlands is not a regular country and cannot be used as a template for any other country in the World, except maybe some flat urban area, like Copenhagen, or the Vatican (which has a few hills more than the Netherlands BTW) p.s. Dutch did not like to hear this, but somebody had to say it.

I don’t think that Berlin has substantially more mountains in the city than Amsterdam. I live on one of the molehills that pretend to be a mountain and I have 22m of height difference to the river. It’s noticeable but hardly insurmountable.

> I don’t think that Berlin has substantially more mountains in the city than Amsterdam

Berlin, in fact, is not a country.

As I've said cannot be used as a template for any other country in the World, **except maybe some flat urban area**

Paris is not the Netherlands, you cannot export the Netherlands ways to Paris.

Moreover, there are on average 150,000 street accidents in Berlin every year.

Last year (2020), 14,782 people were hurt in road accidents in Berlin - the lowest figure in 30 years, according to police data. (thanks COVID I guess...)

In Rome, considered the hell on earth of street rage (69 cars every 100 people, negative record in Europe) ~10.500 people were injured in the same period.

Same population, 1.4 times more accidents.

Perception is very different from reality.

Re: The Citroen Ami – tiny electric car with no boot, 28mph top speed, 46 mile range

#329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Netherlands is not a regular country and cannot be used as a template for any other country in the World, except maybe some flat urban area, like Copenhagen, or the Vatican (which has a few hills more than the Netherlands BTW) p.s. Dutch did not like to hear this, but somebody had to say it.

I’m a daily cyclist in Brussels and my city is far from flat.

I lived in Brussels, please consider the fact that what's considered "not flat" in Brussels is completely flat in 95% of Europe.

Re: The Citroen Ami – tiny electric car with no boot, 28mph top speed, 46 mile range

#330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you wanna have a conversation, please try at least to understand a few simple concepts. A bullet weights 50 grams. Would you prefer to be hit by a bike or a bullet?

I'd prefer a bullet, if it's traveling at 20km/h.

I would prefer a bullet too, compared to an e-bike, at any speed.

Does that mean we should all ride bullets traveling at 20 km/h?

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