Issue dialing 911 on Google Pixel 6 cell phones • Hacker News Board

Re: Issue dialing 911 on Google Pixel 6 cell phones

#181

Post by tlb » Fri, Nov 25, 2022, 4:55 PM UTC

arbitrage wrote: post #95

tlb wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Emission levels are complicated. There isn't a particular threshold they have to be under. Rather, phones negotiate with the tower to use the minimum power needed to get their signal through, depending on their distance from the tower and other factors. Using lower power means less interference with other phones as well as increased battery life and less RF absorption by the user's head. This negotiation has a lot of…

> There isn't a particular threshold they have to be under. This is a patently false thing to say. https://www.fcc.gov/general/cell-phones-and-specific-absorpt...

OK, there's a super-high limit 100x greater than what phone hardware is capable of putting out. But that's not what carriers are testing -- they want to see that it only uses say 0.5 mW, not 1 mW, when close to the base station.

Re: Issue dialing 911 on Google Pixel 6 cell phones

#182

Post by throwaway290 » Fri, Nov 25, 2022, 5:01 PM UTC

zinekeller wrote: post #116

throwaway290 wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for reinforcing my point. Indeed, the phone has a life-threatening defect and I would never own one. "Failure to dial 911" is a scary defect for a phone. Where the title makes a logical mistake and is misleading in order to be sensational is that, assuming "dialing 911" as given context, "phone doesn't ring sometimes" is probably the least scary issue possible. In fact, it's the most common way dialing a numbe…

First, this article is targeted to the general population, not to anal-retentive HN commenters. You're nitpicking on technicalities which while tolerated on posts by HN users (although heavily discouraged unless it's of a technical nature) is definitely out for general articles. Even the guidelines are clear about this: "Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one t…

I merely clarified what the downvoted comment's author meant so that those who reflexively started to argue with it would see they are actually in agreement on substance if they gave it any thought. Talk about generous interpretation and anal reflexiveness.

> a phone that bulges and physically explodes is as dangerous as not being to reliably summon emergency services.

If you are putting forth that a phone exploding when you make a 911 call is an issue of the same magnitude as a phone occasionally not ringing when you make a 911 call, I don't see what else we can discuss...

Re: Issue dialing 911 on Google Pixel 6 cell phones

#183

Post by brookst » Fri, Nov 25, 2022, 5:18 PM UTC

hilbert42 wrote: post #155

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is probably like the fourth or fifth time issues calling 911 has come up for Pixel phones too. Google simply isn't capable of producing life-critical software.

That's obviously true, after all Google's principal role in life is to make money though advertising not through saving lives. As I've said elsewhere, ultimately it's the responsibly of the regulator in each country to ensure that phones can connect to emergency numbers irrespective of what operating system or apps are installed on them—so that's where the problem ought to rest. That said, it's clear that that view d…

I think you’re being unnecessarily hard on Google.

When someone dials 911, there is a ton of context data that needs to be collected, analyzed, and added to Google’s profile of the user to ensure the most relevant ads can be served in the future.

There’s location data, whether the user is driving, connected Bluetooth accessories, other phones in close proximity. All of this needs cutting edge ML processing so the user model can be updated with e.g. “likely domestic violence victim, recommend self defense courses” to improve the user experience the next time they search for a pie recipe.

Given the heavy lift of this advanced algorithmic processing, it’s inevitable that some minor bugs will creep in to ancillary functions like connecting the user’s phone call to emergency services. Even when that happens, it’s still a >95% success for the scenario.

Re: Issue dialing 911 on Google Pixel 6 cell phones

#184

Post by Dylan16807 » Fri, Nov 25, 2022, 5:21 PM UTC

jakear wrote: post #174

cube00 wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've seen statements that at least pretend like the company cares and the steps they are taking to deal with the issue. Something along the lines of "the safety of our users is our highest priority and we are investigating these reports", no admissions, no legal risk, but they couldn't even do that much.

> "the safety of our users is our highest priority and we are investigating these reports", no admissions, no legal risk That statement contains both admissions and legal risk! If they aren't actually investigating the reports (entirely possible), it's a lie. If they don't actually mark "safety" bugs p1 (almost certainly possible), it's a lie.

...which is why no comment looks so bad, because those are easy things that extremely should be happening. (Though "highest" priority shouldn't be taken so specifically.)

No comment is the worst way to avoid that risk, and should be looked down upon.

Re: Issue dialing 911 on Google Pixel 6 cell phones

#185

Post by nunez » Fri, Nov 25, 2022, 5:22 PM UTC

i'm REALLY surprised that this is still a problem, especially after the last 911 fiasco (the one where Teams was preventing users from dialing 911 due to call routing)

it feels like android in general has had issues with 911/112. i remember cyanogenmod ROMs (when that was a thing) having issues as well.

Re: Issue dialing 911 on Google Pixel 6 cell phones

#186

Post by Dylan16807 » Fri, Nov 25, 2022, 5:28 PM UTC

throwaway290 wrote: post #182

zinekeller wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First, this article is targeted to the general population, not to anal-retentive HN commenters. You're nitpicking on technicalities which while tolerated on posts by HN users (although heavily discouraged unless it's of a technical nature) is definitely out for general articles. Even the guidelines are clear about this: "Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one t…

I merely clarified what the downvoted comment's author meant so that those who reflexively started to argue with it would see they are actually in agreement on substance if they gave it any thought. Talk about generous interpretation and anal reflexiveness. > a phone that bulges and physically explodes is as dangerous as not being to reliably summon emergency services. If you are putting forth that a phone exploding…

They said the title was clickbait. You're saying it's illogical. The latter is an incorrect claim, and you're the one making it.

Re: Issue dialing 911 on Google Pixel 6 cell phones

#187

Post by fanatic2pope » Fri, Nov 25, 2022, 5:30 PM UTC

simfree wrote: post #3

vpt wrote: post #2

Here is the associated Google Pixel subreddit thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/GooglePixel/comments/z3knqv/action_...

I don't think this is newsworthy at this point. My Pixel 6 and Pixel 7 both are unreliable when trying to call 911, calling with an over the top app or dialing the PSAP's number directly are the only workarounds. Google doesn't give a fuck about this issue. I have filed repeated support cases over the past year with Google about this when using T-Mobile or Verizon.

I have a Pixel 7, and I am curious how do you test the reliability of calling 911? I assume you don't actually call 911 and say "just testing!"

Re: Issue dialing 911 on Google Pixel 6 cell phones

#188

Post by bobbylarrybobby » Fri, Nov 25, 2022, 5:43 PM UTC

cycomanic wrote: post #144

paganel wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I get this right, we have a $1+ trillion company not being able to build a basic functionality into their phones? (like "phone calls don't work" and the whole calling 911 issue). And, apparently, that was happening because of a shitty app built by another $1+ trillion company? In terms of innovation the US tech scene is toast with these dinosaurs.

And in another thread people talk how "real programmers don't need unit tests", oh the irony.

“With thousands of people using your phones, it'll be clear pretty quickly when something as crucial as 911 stops working. You shouldn't need tests for that.”

Re: Issue dialing 911 on Google Pixel 6 cell phones

#189

Post by 2OEH8eoCRo0 » Fri, Nov 25, 2022, 5:47 PM UTC

dm319 wrote: post #48

I'm all over the place with pocket computing devices and remain confused. I once has an iphone. Beautifully crafted, both inside and out, but so frustratingly locked down that I was desperate to leave it behind. They have progressively opened up the platform, but it always lags behind (I remember I couldn't access the cloud storage from anything other than a mac). My favourite devices have been more alternative. E90…

Same. In the end I choose to die on the freedom hill, adjacent to the privacy hill. I wish there were more options.

Re: Issue dialing 911 on Google Pixel 6 cell phones

#190

Post by bragr » Fri, Nov 25, 2022, 5:48 PM UTC

alistairSH wrote: post #150

crooked-v wrote: post #30

This article, dating back to January, lays it out pretty clearly: https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/01/google-fixes-nightma... > If you're logged out, launching Microsoft Teams 10 times will result in 10 duplicate PhoneAccounts from Teams clogging your phone. Teams shouldn't do this, and Microsoft's update stopped Teams from doing this, but a bunch of duplicate PhoneAccounts also shouldn't be enough to bring Andro…

And why the hell does Google/Android allow 3rd party emergency phone service handlers at all? Something critical like 911 should have one handler. Heck, I’d argue the phone system shouldn’t be allowed to be overloaded by a 3rd party at all. That just sounds like a bowl of buggy spaghetti.

>And why the hell does Google/Android allow 3rd party emergency phone service handlers at all?

It doesn't, but the interaction of registering a bunch of 3rd party voip services interacts with the emergency call system in interesting ways, as explained in detail in the links Ars Technica article.