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Arch Linux turns 20: Small, simple, great documentation

theregister.com

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Re: Arch Linux turns 20: Small, simple, great documentation

#21

Post by gnull »

kadotus wrote: post #18
anthk wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Arch is not minimal. Debian netinstall does the same. Alpine is. If you think Arch is fast, try Alpine x86. On X.Org, VESA works everywhere.

Can you elaborate? In what way is Alpine more minimal than Arch? (I really just don't know) Also are you suggesting that Debian netinstall is not minimal?

Alpine base rootfs is just a few megabytes, while Arch is like 100-200MB. I usually encounter Alpine in Docker containers when people want to wrap just one specific service and have save space on things that are not essential for it (it would be wasteful to ship your 20MB app in a 200MB Arch/Debian container).

I didn't know Alpine was useful as a working machine though.

Re: Arch Linux turns 20: Small, simple, great documentation

#22

Post by hutzlibu »

bradrn wrote: post #19

> The installation process, and the documentation behind it, lead to the third virtue: a complete installation tends to be very small and simple, because you only install the bits you need. If you don't know what bits you need, the documentation will help you to work it out, and the result is something that is both fairly minimal and that, with luck, you understand. You know what's in there because you installed it.…

"For this reason, I’m planning to install Debian instead on the new laptop I’ve ordered"

Maybe have a look at manjaro, it is based on arch, but comes prepackaged, so you can just boot up the luve image and install, if everything works.

Re: Arch Linux turns 20: Small, simple, great documentation

#23

Post by bradrn »

hutzlibu wrote: post #22
bradrn wrote: post #19

> The installation process, and the documentation behind it, lead to the third virtue: a complete installation tends to be very small and simple, because you only install the bits you need. If you don't know what bits you need, the documentation will help you to work it out, and the result is something that is both fairly minimal and that, with luck, you understand. You know what's in there because you installed it.…

"For this reason, I’m planning to install Debian instead on the new laptop I’ve ordered" Maybe have a look at manjaro, it is based on arch, but comes prepackaged, so you can just boot up the luve image and install, if everything works.

I’ve heard of Manjaro, but on the occasions when I’ve brought it up in conversation, people have almost unanimously warned me off from it in fairly strong terms… not entirely sure why, but that alone makes me reluctant to use it.

Re: Arch Linux turns 20: Small, simple, great documentation

#24

Post by pantalaimon »

kadotus wrote: post #18
anthk wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Arch is not minimal. Debian netinstall does the same. Alpine is. If you think Arch is fast, try Alpine x86. On X.Org, VESA works everywhere.

Can you elaborate? In what way is Alpine more minimal than Arch? (I really just don't know) Also are you suggesting that Debian netinstall is not minimal?

Debian is not minimal at all, it emphasizes compatibility over all else.

There are many custom scripts to wrap around systemd so you can still use old style commands. Apt is pretty slow (and again packages come with custom scripts) and stuff like apt-xapian-index will just gobble up all your CPU if you are on a slow system.

Debian has many scripts to automate things for a nice experience, but it's certainly not minimal.

Re: Arch Linux turns 20: Small, simple, great documentation

#26

Post by throwaway62132 »

bradrn wrote: post #19

> The installation process, and the documentation behind it, lead to the third virtue: a complete installation tends to be very small and simple, because you only install the bits you need. If you don't know what bits you need, the documentation will help you to work it out, and the result is something that is both fairly minimal and that, with luck, you understand. You know what's in there because you installed it.…

If one isn't bothered by (or prefers) lack of systemd, Artix provides ISO prepackaged with most common desktop environments.

Re: Arch Linux turns 20: Small, simple, great documentation

#27

Post by e3bc54b2 »

bradrn wrote: post #23
hutzlibu wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"For this reason, I’m planning to install Debian instead on the new laptop I’ve ordered" Maybe have a look at manjaro, it is based on arch, but comes prepackaged, so you can just boot up the luve image and install, if everything works.

I’ve heard of Manjaro, but on the occasions when I’ve brought it up in conversation, people have almost unanimously warned me off from it in fairly strong terms… not entirely sure why, but that alone makes me reluctant to use it.

They had multiple issues with opsec in the past. Something that when repeats, makes people skittish. Fool me once and al..

Re: Arch Linux turns 20: Small, simple, great documentation

#28

Post by autophagian »

trabant00 wrote: post #16

While some may see it as a learning tool I have used Arch on my workstations for 14 years. The last time I remember having to manually fix things was when it migrated to systemd. I am a linux sysadmin so I might be biased but I think people overestimate the effort required to get exactly what you want and nothing more out of an Arch setup.

I'm in the same boat. I started my linux use with everything-bundled distros like Ubuntu but I really appreciated Arch for giving me a better sense of how things tend to hang together. Made me much more comfortable transitioning into sysadmin/sre stuff.

Re: Arch Linux turns 20: Small, simple, great documentation

#29

Post by rmbyrro »

bradrn wrote: post #19

> The installation process, and the documentation behind it, lead to the third virtue: a complete installation tends to be very small and simple, because you only install the bits you need. If you don't know what bits you need, the documentation will help you to work it out, and the result is something that is both fairly minimal and that, with luck, you understand. You know what's in there because you installed it.…

If we could combine Ubuntu's easiness of use with Arch's simplicity and performance, that'd be my ideal distro for work.

I love Arch for its simplicity and performance.

But it just wasn't productive for me to get everyday tasks done. I'm not advanced Linux user, occasionally I'd need hours to get seemingly simple stuff done.

For a hobby desktop, fine. For a work tool as a developer, I moved back to Ubuntu (though I have moments of regret every day).

Re: Arch Linux turns 20: Small, simple, great documentation

#30

Post by hutzlibu »

e3bc54b2 wrote: post #27
bradrn wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve heard of Manjaro, but on the occasions when I’ve brought it up in conversation, people have almost unanimously warned me off from it in fairly strong terms… not entirely sure why, but that alone makes me reluctant to use it.

They had multiple issues with opsec in the past. Something that when repeats, makes people skittish. Fool me once and al..

I am not aware of critical issues, but there was indeed a time of confusion, when the dev leadership changed. So sources please for current flaws?
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