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Japanese have been producing wood for 700 years without cutting down trees

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11–20 of 205 posts

Re: Japanese have been producing wood for 700 years without cutting down trees

#11
post #9

Does the Japanese government pay for or in some way support articles like this? Do people in Japan get articles about how amazing coppicing is in the UK? Articles like this about Japan make me feel a bit weird but I kind of wish we were better at fetishising our own produce and practices like we do with the Japanese.

Oh, indeed - and sometimes worse:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_syndrome

Re: Japanese have been producing wood for 700 years without cutting down trees

#13
post #9

Does the Japanese government pay for or in some way support articles like this? Do people in Japan get articles about how amazing coppicing is in the UK? Articles like this about Japan make me feel a bit weird but I kind of wish we were better at fetishising our own produce and practices like we do with the Japanese.

GK Chesterton made similar points to you, but about religious orientalism, in "The Everlasting Man".

Re: Japanese have been producing wood for 700 years without cutting down trees

#14
post #6

> A similar technique is also used in other parts of the world, such as the UK, but under the name Coppice and Pollarding. While the technique is similar, it's not exactly the same, as daisugi only works with seedlings from a specific mutant cedar in a specific location in Kyoto. Dang, that's a shame.

It’s the champagne of pollarding

Unless your pollarded lumber came from a mutant cedar in a specific location in Kyoto, it's just sparkling timber.

Re: Japanese have been producing wood for 700 years without cutting down trees

#16
I wish there was a way to apply this technique to some of the rarer woods that have fantastic uses in production, like teak, rosewood, and grenadilla.

If you're into hardwoods like musical instruments or fine furniture there's an appreciation you grow for the character of these woods. And a moral quandary with the sourcing of it. It seems impossible to find a sustainable method to source the material. A lot of what we make today will seem impossible in the coming decades.

Grenadilla trees in particular are suffering due to over harvesting and poor oversight in the markets where it is sourced. It is prized for woodwind instruments - and the day is coming where it's only going to be economical to use recycled polymer composites (which have many benefits besides commercial) over true solid wood instruments. If we could sustainably turn these trees into fruit trees harvested over centuries it would be a great service to nature and the industry.

Re: Japanese have been producing wood for 700 years without cutting down trees

#17

>This is an ancient method, developed in the 14th century Isn't it interesting, how most of the history of East Asia just has label "ancient" slapped onto it in pop-culture?

Japan went through a significant cultural upheaval during the Meiji restoration. So much of Japanese culture comes from the Meiji era up into the start of the Taisho era and as a result a lot of people treat everything prior to the Meiji restoration as "ancient times".

Hell unlike most western culture, Japan didn't really get their current system for naming individuals and families until the 1870s.

But as to why all these practices in Japan that date past the Meiji era are considered "ancient", one of the major parts of the restoration was the systematic centralisation of Japanese society and standardisation of practices. This resulted in a lot of practices being more or less outlawed with the surviving practices that weren't officially sanctioned by the central government surviving solely due to rebellious/non-compliant individuals secretly preserving their practices throughout the Meiji era.

Into the late Taisho and early Showa era, the threats of violence from the central government were removed and the stigma around these "outlawed" practices faded, allowing families to publicly practice their "non-standardised" crafts.

This is more or less the reason behind the seemingly endless quantity of "ancient crafts" and "secrets passed down through generations". There was a systematic attempt at eliminating non-conformant practices for a good ~40-60 years. That's at least a few generations who grew up fearing retribution for practicing their family traditions.

There's also a whole orientalisation/fetishisation of Japanese things and concepts. The same applies to the broader east asian and greater asian cultures.

Re: Japanese have been producing wood for 700 years without cutting down trees

#18
When I first drove past freshly coppiced woodland near me I was shocked. What had they done? They'd butchered the forest. All the trees reduced to less than a foot off the ground. They all grow back though and it doesn't take too long for the woods to return to what they looked like before.

Re: Japanese have been producing wood for 700 years without cutting down trees

#19
post #9

Does the Japanese government pay for or in some way support articles like this? Do people in Japan get articles about how amazing coppicing is in the UK? Articles like this about Japan make me feel a bit weird but I kind of wish we were better at fetishising our own produce and practices like we do with the Japanese.

The answers are most likely "yes" and "yes".

Except thay Japanese most likely read about London with its exchanges and culture and not about coppicing. Maybe some Scotland pastoral images, since it also sells hard liquor.

Re: Japanese have been producing wood for 700 years without cutting down trees

#20
Coppicing, Hedge laying, Bocage, drystone walling, wattle-and-daub are all domestic comparable ancient crafts of Europe. The point being that probably only drystone walling is valued in a way comparable to the Japanese version of Coppicing, which really has been transformed into an artform. European coppices are cut close to the rootstock and cut down far younger for use as poles, for wood turning, for hedge laying.

Timber framed construction in Europe was nailless (wooden tree nails permitted) but the mortice and tenon joinery of Japan is in another league. Maybe European Gothic cathedral roofs come close, little else would.

Japan modernised in the modern era, it's industrial revolution was comparatively recent and it remained feudal far longer than Europe (Russian serfdom aside)

There are probably more continuous family heritage firms in Japan practising some art (brewing, soy sauce, woodwork, coppicing) than anywhere else. Can you name a European family concern doing the same thing continuously since before 1600? I can't name any Japanese ones but I wouldn't be surprised if there were many. Institutional enterprises like Oxford university press exist since deep time, but in Japan it would be a continuous lineage of printers continuing to use woodblock printing (maybe alongside hot type or photo typesetting)

Farming does remain in the family but European farming practices have modernised since forever.

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