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US can reach 100% clean power by 2035, DOE finds

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Re: US can reach 100% clean power by 2035, DOE finds

#61

does that mean nuclear power?

Maybe, but that’s the slow option so we should be doing renewables now, which can come online in just months, while the much slower process of adding nuclear capacity unfolds. If we shift the large amount of power generation which renewables can provide over that buys us enough time to build nuclear.

Re: US can reach 100% clean power by 2035, DOE finds

#62

We can have 100% clean energy by 2035 if we assume the US is China and the state can build whatever it wants despite any local objections. And assume we increase battery supply by 40x (even though lithium price is going up dramatically now). And assume that clean power is actually 100% clean. It's good to have a vision for clean energy though that is shared with the country that we start working towards. I can see th…

Much is easier is to simply ban anything not labeled clean. Redefine things to clean when power grids fail.

Or just let millions suffer insane prices.

Helping people rarely a priority.

Re: US can reach 100% clean power by 2035, DOE finds

#63
post #37

We can have 100% clean energy by 2035 if we assume the US is China and the state can build whatever it wants despite any local objections. And assume we increase battery supply by 40x (even though lithium price is going up dramatically now). And assume that clean power is actually 100% clean. It's good to have a vision for clean energy though that is shared with the country that we start working towards. I can see th…

> local objections That's a big component of all this. NIMBYism in this country is becoming a big problem in a lot of ways. Want to build a dense, mixed use development that is less carbon-intensive than single family suburbia? NIMBYs oppose it. Build a transmission line from your green energy source? NIMBYs, again! Build a solar farm? NIMBYs will try and block it.

And if they don't exist, they can be manufactured quite cheaply.

Re: US can reach 100% clean power by 2035, DOE finds

#64

We can have 100% clean energy by 2035 if we assume the US is China and the state can build whatever it wants despite any local objections. And assume we increase battery supply by 40x (even though lithium price is going up dramatically now). And assume that clean power is actually 100% clean. It's good to have a vision for clean energy though that is shared with the country that we start working towards. I can see th…

don't forget where the vast majority of the solar, wind, and battery tech is currently built... and we're going to trust the source completely as we transition? I don't see that happening. Also storage simply isn't ready. Until they can all store 2-5 days of power at a generating facility you're living in a pipe dream to claim "reliable power". Over 200 people in Texas died because of a shitty design during the 2021 arctic blast. Imagine 10x of that because of unreliable sources on a regular basis if we just assume everything will just be okay.

Re: US can reach 100% clean power by 2035, DOE finds

#65
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> local objections That's a big component of all this. NIMBYism in this country is becoming a big problem in a lot of ways. Want to build a dense, mixed use development that is less carbon-intensive than single family suburbia? NIMBYs oppose it. Build a transmission line from your green energy source? NIMBYs, again! Build a solar farm? NIMBYs will try and block it.

Our local library wanted to put in an automated drop-off bin that patrons could drive up to and return books into. It was bitterly contested because the adjacent home owners association was worried about the increased noise and traffic. Keep in mind they were already living next to this library and it already had a parking lot. The city paid to construct a high wall as a compromise. It wasn't terribly expensive, but…

Agreed 100%. You may like this article, that has academic research to back up your thoughts— Not Everyone Should Have a Say; To speed up permitting for energy projects, we’ll need to rethink community input:

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/10/environmen...

This sort of "participatory democracy," where the most motivated can dominate those with less time, can be traced back to the New Left, which was criticized by social democrats at the time.

https://www.dissentmagazine.org/article/a-day-in-the-life-of...

And it goes back further to the 30-40s where communists would drag out meetings late into the night in order to thin out the crowd, and then wait until they had a majority for a vote.

Re: US can reach 100% clean power by 2035, DOE finds

#66
post #37

We can have 100% clean energy by 2035 if we assume the US is China and the state can build whatever it wants despite any local objections. And assume we increase battery supply by 40x (even though lithium price is going up dramatically now). And assume that clean power is actually 100% clean. It's good to have a vision for clean energy though that is shared with the country that we start working towards. I can see th…

> local objections That's a big component of all this. NIMBYism in this country is becoming a big problem in a lot of ways. Want to build a dense, mixed use development that is less carbon-intensive than single family suburbia? NIMBYs oppose it. Build a transmission line from your green energy source? NIMBYs, again! Build a solar farm? NIMBYs will try and block it.

I think you're falsely putting a variety of different people into a single group called "NIMBY" -- people will object to all sorts of measures, and outside of the fact that they have objected they might not necessarily have anything else in common.

Re: US can reach 100% clean power by 2035, DOE finds

#67

OK, fine, but to what extent will it impoverish working people or reduce their wealth? It's more important to consider human happiness and wealth, rather than sacrificing the poor on the altar of carbon emissions.

True, we should serverely reduce military spending to divert into a comprehensive fission program while reintroducing 1950s-level tax brackets and eliminating capital gains exemptions. We could solve the upcoming energy crising while saving money for the impoverished.

Re: US can reach 100% clean power by 2035, DOE finds

#68
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the conclusion: - Multiple hypothetical approaches to reduce nuclear costs are ongoing. No one knows for sure if any of them will work, or which one will work best And it didn't address the time scale issue at all. OTOH, solar power has a 5 decade history of 90% cost reductions per decade.

What's your point? The guy doesn't have a few billion to single handedly throw at the problem to test them out. There are feasible solutions to make it less expensive, whether or not they get put into practice is a different topic. The point is that nuclear is not inherently and permanently as expensive as it has been for the past few decades. > And it didn't address the time scale issue at all. The time scale issue…

How can the design be standardized? Each location has its own risks to deal with. Extreme heat in Arizona, earthquakes in California, flooding in Florida. Every nuclear plant is a bit different. There is no economics of scale when building nuclear plants.

Re: US can reach 100% clean power by 2035, DOE finds

#70

OK, fine, but to what extent will it impoverish working people or reduce their wealth? It's more important to consider human happiness and wealth, rather than sacrificing the poor on the altar of carbon emissions.

Rich people generate far more carbon emissions than the poor, and the heaviest impacts of climate change will be borne by the poor, who have the least reserves to cushion the blow.
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